Author and workplace strategist Lindsey Pollack shares a negotiation story with a big twist and a surprise ending. Plus how we often fail ourselves in negotiations by not using simple techniques when putting together deals, and how we can learn to up our game. 

In Lindsey's money story you will learn:

So my money story goes back to before I wrote all those books and had the lovely credentials that you shared. About 10 years ago, I was speaking on college campuses to students about getting jobs and I really wanted to elevate my business to the next level. And so I wanted to connect with a large brand that would help me raise my image and get into the corporate market.

And through a connection of a connection of a connection, I ended up having the opportunity to pitch a major social network. And my pitch to them was that I wanted to run a series of webinars to campus career centers to teach them how to use this social network and get their students to use it for their career success. You can probably guess which network it was.

And I had no platform. I had no reputation. I had nothing to offer. And so what I did -

Let me just ask you, how had you even been connected to them?

I was so set on a couple of different companies wanting to work with that I asked everyone that I knew, "Hey, do you know anyone at this company?" And it took one full year, Bobbi and finally, a friend of a friend worked out in Silicon Valley and said, "I know someone there, I'm willing to make an introduction." So I asked until I finally got a yes.

So you had already invested quite a bit of time and energy in this and a lot of tenacity. Okay. So now you get your moment, keep going.

Okay. So I got my moment and I wrote up a huge fancy proposal that I was really proud of and I thought, "How am I going to price this?" They don't know me. I did not want to do it for free. And so what I did, was I came up with two tiers. I came up with the tier that was a very, very low investment for this company to pay me to start this webinar and run it.

And then I came up with a really, really high number and said, "If I can train 5000 people in two months. If 5000 people signed up to take this webinar in two months, you'll pay me this number." And they agreed to it because they basically had nothing to lose because the first number was really small.

Well I mean you've transferred all of the risk. You're taking on all the risk if the project were to not go well. They basically don't have much at stake. The payment from them would be so small. But of course, you are getting huge reward if it goes well which of course I know it does. But keep going.

It went well. I did everything humanly possible to get 5000 people to sign up for those webinars. And I do want to give credit that I had a very warm introduction. So I think that network and connection really helped. But I worked like crazy to get those people to sign up. I made the number. And the best part of the story is that I continued to work with that company for six more years. So I think by proving myself at the beginning, I was able to start the relationship off right and it truly was a game-changer for my business.

In Lindsey’s money lesson you will learn:

I think there are two lessons. One is to be really clear on what you want and if you get the introduction you want or if you get the opportunity you want, how are you going to turn it into something big. I think a lot of people say they want success or they want to write a book or they want to get their script produced. But once you have the opportunity in front of you, what are you going to do to make sure that you get a yes. And I can't say I knew at the time that this would be such a lesson but it was so empowering to know that I was willing to put everything on the table and work tenaciously, as you said, to get it. So know what you want and really think about how you can get the other side to say yes. Even if it means that you have to put some risk on the table.

You also mentioned the term a warm introduction. Can you talk more about how that came about, how that comes about, how people can get that more, and the importance of the kind introduction that you get? The nuance there.

Absolutely. And Bobbi, you are such a good practitioner of this generously making introductions for people you know and trust. I think that it's really easy to connect with someone today, whether it's on a social network, whether it's sending an email, finding somebody's phone number. That's easy. What's harder is standing out from the crowd. And I think the way to do that is when you have a person, a human being, who knows and trusts you who always knows and is trusted by the person you want to meet.

So I don't think it was just me and my proposal that got that company to say yes. I think it was the fact that someone who they trusted and vouched for me was able to make that introduction. You know we live in a world of a lot of connections but that true trusted connection, I think is more valuable than ever. That to me is a warm connection.

In Lindsey's everyday money tip you will learn:

I am laughing that my money story is about how great of a negotiator I am because it took me so long to learn how to improve my negotiation skills and my best negotiation tip is silence.

So why? We let there be a moment of silence there so everyone could think about that.

Silence is really uncomfortable. And I'm so glad you let that moment linger because it shows how much anyone wants to desperately make that silence go away. And so what I used to do, when I first started out as a speaker or as an author, was say something like, "Bobbi, the price of my speech is $1000." And if there was a nanosecond of silence, I would say, "But if you only want to pay 750 that's okay." Because I was so uncomfortable with the silence.

So letting a number sit there. Asking somebody, even if you're on the phone with your mobile phone provider saying, "Is that the best you can do? Can you offer me a different rate?" We jump in too quickly and say, "Or not, that's okay. Forget it." Letting that silence linger is so hard and has been a huge challenge for me but it is my best money tip to not talk myself down or lose an opportunity to get a better price because I'm not willing to sit with silence.

Can you recall any time that was super effective using that technique? Can you give us an example?

Oh, everyday when I'm negotiating for my business. As I've gotten more successful as a speaker, I've raised my prices. And probably the hardest one to do is to raise a price on an existing valued client. But over time, it's really a necessity to grow your business.

I had to say to someone just the other day, "I've raised my prices by 15%. I know that we've always been at X number. The new number is this." And I so wanted to say, "But if you don't want to pay that's okay." Or, "I know that might be challenging." But I just said it, I let it sit there and the person said, "Okay."

In My Take you will learn:

Financial Grownup Tip number one: Lindsey talked about warm introductions and I could not agree more. But how do you get started? Well the most important thing is to reach out and ask people in your industry or even just friends and family and just casual conversation to tell you more about what they're working on, what their goals are, and lead into how you might be able to help them. Don't be overly aggressive. But be creative. Are there things that you could do? And then follow up. And this is the most important thing. Don't ask them for anything in return.

The crazy thing that I have found is that the people that have come forward on my behalf and made introductions for me, aren't always the ones that I have helped. It's not always linear. In fact, it rarely is. Very often the people helping me are people that aren't necessarily in my closest circles. They're people that I've met through my life that I've stayed in touch with. Maybe a quick email every six months, a quick coffee date once or twice a year. That kind of thing. And just being in touch with them and being considerate of what they're going through and what their needs are, maybe they'll think of you when an opportunity that's appropriate for you comes about. Or maybe they'll be there for you if you want an introduction to someone that they know. Be patient. If you give, you will receive.

Financial Grownup Tip number two: Lindsey's book is so full of great tips for us. She shared a couple, but I wanted to give a little bit more. So here are some other tips from Lindsey.

First of all, if you can work up the courage and feel comfortable and if you don't then get comfortable, do this, work up to this. Ask your boss to CC you on emails even when you don't need to be directly involved. It's going to give you insights into things that are going on in your company beyond your immediate duties, give you a wider perspective.

Lindsey also suggests sending video emails on occasion instead of writing out what you want to say. Just film a quick video and attach it to an email. It can be very effective.

One more final tip: Remix your meetings. Just try sitting in different seats than you usually do and that could actually change the group dynamic and maybe the group think. Come up with some different ideas or just give you a little more energy in your day.

Episode Links:

• Blinkist - The app I’m loving right now. Please use our link to support the show and get a free trial.

• Check out Lindsey's website - www.LindseyPollak.com

• Lindsey's new book The Remix

Follow Lindsey!

• Instagram - @LindseyPollak

• Facebook - @LindseyPollakAuthor

• Twitter - @LindseyPollak

• LinkedIn - @LindseyPollak

• YouTube

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Broke Millennial’s Erin Lowry joins Bobbi with 3 specific things you can do today to upgrade your investing strategy, along with her take on how to be a successful investor.  For example: How much should you be paying for your investments? How long should you set it and forget it- when do you check in on your investments? What is an investment audit? Are all index funds the same? Plus a preview of her new book “Broke Millennial Takes on Investing’ . How to tell if your goals are in line with the investment choices you are making? And what to do if you don’t understand an investment term but don’t want to ask. 

Here are the 3 things you must know about actionable investing tips

• Increase contributions in small increments

• Pay attention to expense ratios- they matter so much

• write down goals and check in once a year

Episode Links:

• Erin's new book Broke Millennial Takes On Investing: A Beginner's Guide to Leveling Up Your Money

• Erin's first book Broke Millennial: Stop Scraping By and Get Your Financial Life Together

• Jill Schlesinger's Financial Grownup episode

Check out Erin's website -

www.BrokeMillennial.com

Follow Erin!

• Instagram - @BrokeMillennialBlog

• Pinterest - @BrokeMillennial

• Twitter - @BrokeMillennial

• Facebook - @BrokeMillennial

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

3 dumb things smart people do with their money

• How to avoid taking advice from the wrong people- and how to find the right trusted sources.

• How to protect yourself from identity theft, and avoid doing the dumb things that make you vulnerable.

• How to both avoid spending money on the wrong insurance, and how to know what insurance you do need. Plus how to adjust your insurance as you go through different life stages as a financial grownup.

Episode Links:

• Jill’s book Dumb Things Smart People Do With Their Money

• Website - Jill on Money

• Jill on Money podcast

Follow Jill!

• Twitter - @JillonMoney

• Facebook - @JillonMoney

• Instagram - @JillonMoney

• LinkedIn - @JillonMoney

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Sadie Kurzban won $25,000 in a college contest for entrepreneurs by using a strategy that has continued to drive the growth of her boutique dance fitness chain. The millennial entrepreneur shares her secrets to building a business on a low budget, along with her personal tips on how she manages healthy meals on a budget with her relentless schedule.

Sadie’s Money Story:

Bobbi Rebell:
For your money story, you're going to actually talk to us about how you got the funding to start this, because you were just in college.

Sadie Kurzban:
I was, yes. I started teaching aerobics classes really for fun in college because I was passionate about it. I had always loved group fitness and I thought, well let me take my hand at giving this a try. So I was teaching it for fun and when I was thinking about what I wanted to do for my career around graduation, that my senior year my friend turned to me and she was like, "Girl, like this is your passion, you need to do this" and I was like, "What? I'm not going to graduate college and go be a fitness instructor".

Bobbi Rebell:
You were at Brown University by the way.

Sadie Kurzban:
Yes, I graduated top of my class. Everyone around me was getting a job in consulting. They were going to medical school, going to law school and I was like, "I think I should go do something like that". So I was like, "How am I going to go?" I even, I remember I looked up in Brown alumni who's in fitness, even just as a category and there was like one alumni from the 70's like it's just not a very popular thing to do. So, I was like, "God, I'm not going to go. Yeah, I have bigger ambitions than being a trainer". So she said, "Why don't you just start a business?" I was like, "What?" I had never even thought about starting a business, truly. This was right before senior year.

Sadie Kurzban:
We started looking up in the course curriculum, entrepreneurship, accounting, really we were kind of scrambling and I ended up majoring in economics, which was really funny and unexpected. But I took every entrepreneurship related, business related, accounting related. It was my entire senior year I was filled with these courses, studying my tail off and I entered the big annual business plan pitch competition. So it's a 10 minute pitch. It's all students, almost all the teams were all male. A lot of the teams were graduate students who had invented like incredible things like medical devices, like really impressive businesses and here I was, I was like, "I'm going to start this dance cardio workout. It has a DJ. It's really fun. This is why I should win". It was really surprising at the end of the day that I won, but it really was the sign from the universe that I needed to move to New York and make this happen.

Bobbi Rebell:
Why do you think you won? What was the differentiator?

Sadie Kurzban:
Yeah, I'll tell you why I think I won was that it's held in the school auditorium and it's a pretty nerdy competition. A lot of business majors, a lot of masters students that I got hundreds of kids who would come take my class every week. I said, "I'm entering this pitch competition. If you love these fitness classes I've been teaching, please come and cheer me on". So I packed the room. I mean, honestly, with 300, 400 students that were screaming their heads off for me. So I think the judges, while they thought, well maybe, I don't know if they felt this was the most impressive business, but what they definitely saw was I had proven the concept and I had really gotten a handful of ... More than a handful of really passionate evangelists. So they knew I was onto something and getting people super passionate about this early on has been the biggest gift and the biggest way that we've grown so quickly, as you know with limited resources, getting customers to really evangelize us and tell their friends.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, and then you got the $25,000 to get going.

Sadie Kurzban:
Yeah, it was enough to at least give me the confidence to move to New York and give myself nine months to try and make it happen.

Sadie’s Money Lesson:

Sadie Kurzban:
I think the biggest lesson there is, I didn't worry so much about all of the 'what if's' and the house and even moving to New York and all of these things and renting space. I just thought about how can I get every customer who walks in to really go back to their next dinner, to work the next day and talk about this like it's nobody's business, right? So with pretty limited resources, $25,000 in New York City is not a lot of money at all. I knew I didn't have a lot of room for error, but what I did have was customers in front of me every day and if I could get one person super jazzed about this, telling 10 people, that was free marketing for me. So I had to really deliver on the experience and most importantly stop worrying about all the 'what if's' and what could happen. Really think about that person in front of me and look at them as a real opportunity to keep just running through the doors that have been opened for me and breaking the glass ceiling.

Bobbi Rebell:
Your instructors are really brand ambassadors.

Sadie Kurzban:
They are, yes. We all live in Brea, 305 and we know how important that client in front of us is.

Sadie’s Money Tip:

Sadie Kurzban:
So yeah, I was thinking a little bit about this because they listened to your show and I have to admit I'm not great at saving. I'm a little bit better at just creating things and I tend to kind of close my eyes and drive at the same time when it comes to money. But the one way that I really do, I think successfully saved is again, in a city like New York where it's really tempting to do seamless every night or go to dinner, that can really add up big time, like $30, $40 every night. So instead what I do is, I cook and I eat a lot of homemade meals or I'll pack it to the office. But the best thing that I found is really, instead of, it would just be so daunting to get home late at night and cook for myself every night this [inaudible 00:07:48] meal.

Sadie Kurzban:
So what I do is I cook a whole bunch on Sundays, like a bunch, as much as I can. I refrigerate enough for three days and then everything left over I freeze. So by the time the weekend rolls around, unfolding and I'm cooking again. So it's enough what I make on Sunday to really carry me through the week and within that what I've found is another tip within that is, that if I put all this pressure on myself to make these gourmet meals and I'm chopping onions and all these things, I'm just not going to do it. I'm going to wake up on Sunday and I'm going to think no way, no way. So instead I'll splurge a bit on the pain in the butt stuff like chopping onions, chopping garlic. This stuff that I know is going to come up in every recipe, I'll get those precut so I'll spend the extra dollar at trader Joe's knowing that someone else's has cut or a machine has cut the onions for me and that way I know I can make the meal in five minutes instead of taking me 15 minutes to make everyone.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love it. That's so practical and it's also important because you aren't just sitting in an office, you actually go and teach these classes.

Bobbi’s Financial grownup tips:

Financial grownup tip number one:

Sadie won that first $25,000 in college by doing something no one else did. She literally brought her own cheering section of happy clients. They were there to cheer for her, but they were also there with her. None of us can do everything alone. Sadie doesn't, she brings others along for the ride. If you do that in your life with anything, not just business, but anything that matters to you, include others, make them stakeholders in your success and also you can hear it in her voice, it just made it so much fun.

Financial grownup tip number two:

I love Sadie's hybrid approach to cooking at home. You will not get a prize if you chop every single onion. It is more than okay to splurge and pay a little more to have some ingredients prepped for you so you're more likely to not only eat healthy but also not waste money ordering out and having food delivered. The key thing, and I'm still working on this myself, is the organizational element and the planning.

Episode Links:

• Blinkist - The app I’m loving right now. Please use our link to support the show and get a free trial.

• 305 Fitness career opportunities

• Money with Friends podcast

• Sadie’s website - 305 Fitness

Follow Sadie!

• Instagram - @305fitness

• Twitter - @305fitness

• Facebook - @305fitness

• Pinterest - @305fitness

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Sadie Kurzban won $25,000 in a college contest for entrepreneurs by using a strategy that has continued to drive the growth of her boutique dance fitness chain. The millennial entrepreneur shares her secrets to building a business on a low budget, along with her personal tips on how she manages healthy meals on a budget with her relentless schedule. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode you’ll learn how Sadie built her business on a budget and how you can too. #Budget #Entrepreneur #Fitness

Sharon Epperson survived a brain aneurism. But despite being one of the country's top personal finance experts, and having all the right plans in place, some of the experiences with the finances of her medical emergency still caught her off guard.

In Sharon's money story you will learn:

• The plans she put into place early on that helped her when she ended up in the ER from a brain aneurysm

• The importance of having an emergency fund

• The financial set back she experienced once she was out of the hospital

In Sharon’s money lesson you will learn:

• The importance of money saved

• Why it's so important to have an estate plan

• Having adequate medical insurance even when you feel like it's so expensive

• Why she's so grateful to have disability insurance

In Sharon's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Know financially where you stand financially. Check your alerts every day on your phone

In My Take you will learn:

• Do the paperwork in case of a medical emergency, specifically a living will

• If you aren't in a mental state to fully understand what you are signing, wait until a loved one gets there

Episode Links:

• Sharon's book The Big Payoff

• Host of Retire Well

• Sharon’s episode on Farnoosh Torabi’s podcast So Money

• Sharon’s episode on Jean Chatzky’s podcast Her Money

• The article I mention in this episode

• Brain Aneurysm Foundation

Follow Sharon!

• Instagram - @sharoneppersoncnbc

• LinkedIn - @sharoneppersoncnbc

• Twitter - @sharon_epperson

• Facebook - @CNBCSharonEpperson

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Sharon Epperson:
I remember lying on the stretcher at the Rehab Hospital having just been brought in, and handed a clipboard with paperwork. No one who has suffered a brain injury, should be handed a clipboard of paperwork and a pen for anything.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to you Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobby Rebell. Author of How to be a Financial Grownup, and you know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay, we're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello financial grownup friends. This episode is an uncomfortable one. I had a really tough time approaching the topic because it's really sensitive. It's really hard to ask the stuff that I ask our guest about. First, a quick welcome note to everyone, our new listeners. Thank you for coming and checking us out. If you enjoy the show, please tell friends. That is the best way for us to grow the podcast, and keep bringing it to you. To today's guest, CNBC's senior personal finance corresponded, Sharon Epperson was really gracious and open in this interview. She has already talked extensively about the brain aneurysm that she suffered a couple of years ago, and about her recovery. But she agreed to venture into an area that is really taboo, and that is asking what do things cost in an emergency? And what can you do to control the cost in an emergency? Because you can't exactly shop around and you may just get the biggest bill of your entire life. So the stakes are really high. Here is Sharon Epperson. Hey, Sharon Epperson, you're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Sharon Epperson:
Thanks so much for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
We met recently at the taping of Secrets of Wealthy Women. I can't believe we didn't know each other before. I don't think we overlapped at all, but I'm a CNBC alum and you are the personal finance correspondent for CNBC.

Sharon Epperson:
I am.

Bobbi Rebell:
You are named 2018, one of the 12 to watch in TV news. You also have a bestselling book, The Big Payoff; Eight steps couples Can take to make the most of their money, and live richly ever after. Congratulations on all of that. And you are also deeply affected by a horrible medical tragedy. You had a brain aneurysm in 2016, and you've been very candid talking about it. I want to encourage everyone, I'm going to leave links to hear the full story because it's important that people hear everything that happened to you. How it happened, how you've dealt with it and everything. But there's one area that for this short show I was actually afraid to ask you to even talk about, and you were so gracious when I sent you this email because it's an important part of what happens after the fact.

Bobbi Rebell:
Can you us, in your money story, about the brain aneurysm? How it happened, but then as I said, and this is hard to talk about, the money aspects of it, and what happened on the financial side while your life is ... We don't even know what's going to happen. You're fighting for your life, and after the fact the money is discussed. Tell us your money story. Sharon.

Sharon Epperson:
I one day went to exercise class and then did not come home again for a month. I'm the person that handles the bills, the daily expenses in my family. All of that pretty much came to a full stop when I was in the hospital. The things that saved us are one, we are both, my husband and I, employed by companies that have medical insurance, and comprehensive coverage. And I was under his employer's insurance actually, and had really great medical care, and was not really conscious of how expensive the bills were for what I had done in a 24-hour period. I do know that I saw more than 50 or 60 medical professionals, and I was in three different hospitals. I remember going to the doctor's office. I remember my husband taking me to the ER. I do not remember much after that, other than the ER doc saying I had bleeding in my brain and calling my sister who lives out of town to tell her that.

Sharon Epperson:
And then I was pretty much unconscious. I remember being in [inaudible 00:04:25], before the anesthesiologist put me under. So anything that happened, all of the decisions that had to be made, financial, medical, everything, in the period of time, but pretty much from the time I left the doctor's office till they decided I had to have this type of emergency and surgery and the particulars of that. I had no involvement. So, I wasn't doing what I usually do [crosstalk 00:04:45]. Before I have a procedure or I take my kids somewhere, I call the insurance company. I say, "Is this covered? Do I ... Have I met my family deductible? What do I have to?" So I know ... I'm a budgeter, so I'd know how much I'm going to be spending for the orthodontia, and the and the other things that I've ... medicines and all that, that I have had over the years with my children.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what happens in this situation? Because this is by far the biggest medical spence you hopefully, God help us, will ever have in your life.

Sharon Epperson:
Exactly. It played out in real time in real life, in my medical emergency. My sister was the first call that I made. She was on the next train from Washington, D.C. to New York, and she was present before I went into surgery. So, all of those decisions, my husband and my sister conferred together and made for me, for my care. Ultimately the paperwork that I assumed was signed, that I wasn't able to sign that says, you got to pay for this if your insurance doesn't cover it, my husband has signed for that too. So, all of those financial medical decisions were made by them for the first month, I would say, after I had my aneurysm.

Sharon Epperson:
I will say that I was actually the one, when I went from by ambulance from the first hospital to the Rehab Hospital two weeks after my surgery, I remember lying on the stretcher at the Rehab Hospital having just been brought in, and handed a clipboard with paperwork. No one who has suffered a brain injury should be handed a clipboard of paperwork and a pen for anything. I mean, I'm still floored that that happened, and I think I had more faculties than probably a lot of people at that may have. But I went through a period, and I actually still do, where I have someone, I kind of run by most of my financial decisions and things by somebody just for a gut check sometimes. and also just for a double check if I've missed anything in the fine print. And I think he later was consulted and everything worked out insurance wise, thankfully, with that hospital as well. But I definitely signed paperwork on a stretcher. That was not cool.

Bobbi Rebell:
No, it's not cool. And I have read recently of some hospitals, one in particular that I'm thinking of and I will put the article in the show notes, in California where it is presumed most hospitals are "in network." But this hospital is not and it is a major trauma center, and people get brought to hospitals and then they believe, because most hospitals are "in network" that they will be covered under whatever their insurance plan, but that's not always true. You really at this point, this is life or death. You're not in control of these decisions and the financial decisions that do come afterwards.

Sharon Epperson:
You are asked to be in control of them. The other memory that I have is when I was in the first hospital, the social worker came and asked me what type of facility I wanted to be in next. I didn't at the time, didn't have enough information really to even know exactly what had happened to me, or what the difference between the sub acute and acute facility was. They just both sounded really scary, and I just started crying. Because it just sounded like, I was slowly figuring out that what had happened to me was extremely serious. But in that discussion, I think the ones that she suggested, as I recall, she did mention were covered under my insurance, but it wasn't necessarily ... I don't remember if I asked it or if she just told it to me.

Sharon Epperson:
But again, to your point, you're suggesting places based on medical care, or proximity to my home, but not necessarily based on what's covered or what's covered more fully. And these are questions that need to be asked, but I was by myself when I was approached.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right? And that's a very financially vulnerable position to be in because your life is at stake, and your life is what matters, but yet you are ... Other people very often are making decisions for you or asking you to make decisions that you are not in a position to make at that point, that will have huge financial consequences when you get better. For example, I wonder how it worked with all the various tests that they did, and other specialists that they're bringing in. Did somebody look and say, "Do you want someone in plan?"

Sharon Epperson:
That absolutely happened. I remember having to have a call with the insurance company about a specialist who was in the ER. I don't remember what exactly the test was that I had, and specialist was not in the same network exactly. And I had to appeal, and say that I was unconscious, had no ability to say yes or no to this test. It was a test that had to be done because I was literally at a near death situation. And once I explained it, it was taken care of. But again, you are critically ill, you've slowly recovered and you're not near yourself again, and you're confronted with having to deal with insurance companies who are second guessing what you had no control over. The main focus of my family was making sure I stayed alive, and get the best medical care possible.

Sharon Epperson:
And they were not thinking about the financial situation at that particular time. And certainly were not trying to make sure that every specialist that I saw was in the network. And I'll probably also just assume that if the hospital is in the network that the specialists would be in the network in the same way, and that's not always the case.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, what is your advice now in hindsight to our listeners, should they ever be in an emergency situation and face financial decisions, or then not face them until the emergency is over?

Sharon Epperson:
The thing that is so very important is to make sure that you have a plan, an estate plan ideally. And some people say, "I don't have an estate. I have no money. Why do I need to have an estate plan?"

Bobbi Rebell:
It's kind of mislabeled the word estate.

Sharon Epperson:
Exactly. You need this to have people in place who can help you with decisions that you're unable to make. And you can do that verbally with family members and just say, "If anything ever happens to me, I want you to be the one." But that's not what's going to hold up necessarily at a hospital or definitely not in a court. So you want to make sure that you have it in writing, and that you have the legal documents necessary for power of attorney, for health care proxy, for financial and for medical decisions to be made. And the other thing I guess I would say is to make sure that you have medical insurance, and when you're an independent contractor, self employed, have your own business. I know it's expensive, it's really difficult to figure out, but it's so very important to make sure that you have adequate comprehensive medical insurance.

Sharon Epperson:
And I'll add one more. There's four things I'll say and that's disability insurance. Again, extremely expensive if you're self employed, but you are protecting your income. You are protecting the greatest financial asset that you likely have, which is your ability to work and make money.

Bobbi Rebell:
And what about dealing with the finances in a medical emergency? What's your takeaway there?

Sharon Epperson:
If you can, I would say, "I'm waiting for my ..." whomever that power of attorney or that person you've designated, "to come. Can we have this conversation when my husband, loved one friend, caregiver, someone is there with me?" And I know for many people that might be hard. Also, I had a friend who's really good and really technical, and really organized and is really good at harassing people to make sure that she gets her money, and she helped me with a lot of my bill paying and the discussions I had to have with insurance companies. So, it's hard to do by yourself. It's very, very difficult and I had people, thankfully in my network.

Sharon Epperson:
There are also agencies out there that will help. That help caregivers are that help people in terms of being your advocate for healthcare issues, but it's just hard to know. And Bobbi, you may know better, who can you trust? You do your [palase 00:12:21] and core [Barre 00:12:22] class, and you ran the marathon, and you did this and you eat ... you drink this spinach smoothie. I had a spinach smoothie and an hour later I had a brain aneurism. So, you never ever ... in an exercise class. So, you never ever, ever know what can happen and when it can happen, and so having that conversation, it's not a downer. It's I'm going to be in the strongest possible position for the rest of my life.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right, let's switch gears to a more uplifting topic, and that is your everyday money tip, which no one has ever said I believe on Financial Grownup and yet it is something we can all do that will really help us on a day to day basis.

Sharon Epperson:
You have to know where you stand financially before you can plan on where you want to go. And so, I set up alerts through my bank, text alerts or email alerts on how much money I have in my account on a daily basis. Whenever I go over spending $250, when I have a bill that's paid that's over $250 from my account. All of these alerts come into my phone, so my money tip is to everyday check in. If it makes you crazy to do it every day, do it every week. But I check in every day, because I get an email on my phone that let's me know how much money I have to spend.

Bobbi Rebell:
Great Advice. Before I let you go, I just want to talk briefly about your efforts to raise awareness, and to advocate for more research about brain aneurysms. You established the Sharon Epperson share of research through the Brain Aneurysm Foundation. It provides grants for research on early detection. Tell us a little bit more about that and how people can support that effort.

Sharon Epperson:
I am the fourth generation of my family members to suffer a brain hemorrhage. And so while I don't know for sure if the brain hemorrhages of my great grandfather, grandfather, and my mother's eldest sister was caused by a brain aneurysm, I know it's very likely that that is the reason why I suffered one. And brain aneurysms are more likely to impact women than men, and twice as likely to rupture in African Americans than in whites. And so, as the mother of two children, who I'm not sure yet whether they are going to be completely healthy or may have a brain aneurysm, I want to make sure that the best technology, the best strategies for treatment, and for dealing with this are available to them. And so I'm supporting the Brain Aneurysm Foundation, which is at the forefront of raising money for research for brain aneurysms. And of lobbying in Washington to increased federal funding for this type of research also.

Sharon Epperson:
So, I would urge people to go to beafound.org to learn more about what happened to me, and what research is being done. And also to support the Sharon Epperson share of research so that more research dollars can be given to very, very, very smart researchers and medical professionals who are coming up with cutting edge, innovative treatments and strategies to deal with this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well. Thank you for all of your efforts. And finally just share with us your social channels and where people can learn more about you and follow all of your endeavors.

Sharon Epperson:
You can follow me on Twitter @Sharon_Epperson S-H-A-R-O-N_Epperson, E-P-P-E-R-S-O-N. I'm on Instagram at Sharon Epperson, CNBC. You can also reach out to me on Linkedin or Facebook, on my Facebook page. And I love to connect with viewers, and readers, and listeners and know what your money stories are. I love your show. I love what you're doing because the more that we talk about this, none of this is taboo. We all have something. We all have something that we're dealing with there were going through, or that we have gone through. And by sharing with one another the ways we've coped, things we've done well and things we have not done well, I think it helps everyone. So, I urge people to reach out to me, and I thank you so much for inviting me to be on your show.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you so much for joining us, Sharon.

Sharon Epperson:
Take care.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay, my friends, Financial Grownup tip number one, do the paperwork in case of a medical emergency, specifically a living will. That is, a written statement saying what you want in terms of medical treatment if you cannot give consent, like Sharon. Financial Grownup tip number two, if you're in a medical emergency and someone is thrusting forums at you, as was the case with Sharon, and you are not in a mental state to fully understand what you are signing, tell them that. Tell them that you need to wait until a loved one gets there. Tell them the reason. That you are not fully able to understand what you are signing. And if you do sign under duress and it comes back to haunt you, consult a lawyer. What happened to Sharon as she says is not okay.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you as always for joining us. I am blown away by the incredible gift that Sharon has given to all of us, and I want to hear from you what you think, and what kind of experiences you have had with medical bills and emergencies. DM Me on Instagram at Bobbi Rebell1, and on Twitter @BobbyRebell. You can always email me at hello@financialgrownup.com and please do share the podcast with friends. That along with ratings and reviews possibly on Apple iTunes are the best. And by the way, I have a new additional podcast I'd love for you guys to check out, it is called Money in the Morning with my cohost Joe [Saulcihi 00:17:35]. We talk about news headlines and why they matter to you.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right, big things to Sharon Epperson for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups. Financial grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Journalist Veronica Dagher lost her dad as a young child and grew up watching her mom learn how to manage the family’s business and money. That experience inspired her to not only focus on her own finances, but to build a career around teaching women financial independence.

In Veronica's money story you will learn:

• How the loss of her dad shaped her view of finances and forced her to learn about money management at an early age.

• The financial grownup lesson that Veronica learned from her mother at a young age that has stuck with her

• Learning how to handle your finances now is essential so you are ready and prepared if something tragic happens in your life

In Veronica’s money lesson you will learn:

• How becoming financially literate can really help out your future self

• The reasons Veronica is so passionate about women being financially savvy

In Veronica's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Why she feels that having a positive money mantra that you tell yourself daily is so important

In My Take you will learn:

• The benefits of askng your parents about their money experiences

• How to leverage tough money experiences to make an impact that helps others.

Episode Links:

• Secrets of Wealthy Women podcast

• I Stack Benjamins

Check out Veronica’s stories in The Wall Street Journal

Follow Veronica!

• Instagram - @veronicadagher

• LinkedIn - @veronicadagher

• Twitter - @veronicadagher
  

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Veronica Dagher:
I would see her crying or upset or frustrated, and just wondering what was going on. I did hear rumblings of "So-and-so tried to, you know, con me into something." Or I would hear little bits and pieces of that once in a while, or some relative would tell me and, not really fully understanding, just knowing that things at times got nasty.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to "Financial Grownup," with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of "How to Be a Financial Grownup," and, you know what, being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay. We're gonna get there together.

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We've got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello, financial grownups. The voice you just heard was that of a friend of mine getting a lot of attention recently, because she co-created and hosts one of the hottest podcasts, not just in the business space, but among podcasts overall. It is called "Secrets of Wealthy Women," and, as she will share with us, it really all began with her mom. Welcome to all and, to our newest listeners, thank you for checking out the show.

Bobbi Rebell:
We try to keep the episodes short, but if you have more time, maybe you're commuting, at about 15 minutes each, the episodes are perfect to listen to a few of them, back-to-back, to fit your schedule.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's get to Veronica. She is an award-winning senior wealth management reporter for the Wall Street Journal. She is also, as I mentioned, the co-creator, host, and co-producer of the top-rated Wall Street Journal's "Secrets of Wealthy Women" podcast. She interviews some of the most well-known women in the world. People like like Gloria Steinem, Bobbi Brown, and Rebecca Minkoff. She also co-produces and hosts videos for wsj.com and is a regular guest on the Fox Business Network and other national media, where she speaks about women, personal finance, markets, the economy, just about anything in the news.

Bobbi Rebell:
As you can tell, I am a huge fan of Veronica's, and I know, if you aren't already, you soon will be, too. Here is Veronica Dagher.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Veronica Dagher. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Veronica Dagher:
Thanks for having me, Bobbi. Great to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
I have to first of all thank you because I had the honor of being a guest on your super-popular podcast, "Secrets of Wealthy Women," which you do through your job at the Wall Street Journal. And, just to give everyone a sense of how big this is, this is almost in the top 100 of all podcasts in the entire podcasting universe at this point. It's definitely in the top, I don't know, five or six business podcasts. Your guests include people like Bobbi Brown, Gloria Steinem, Bethany Frankel, a favorite of mine. And, of course, you had a special podcast around New Year's with myself, Jean Chatzky from The Today Show, Farnoush Cherobi from Oprah Magazine and her podcast, "So Money." I should say, Jean Chatzky also has a podcast called "Her Money."

Bobbi Rebell:
And we had Sharon Epperson from CNBC. We had Deirdre Bolton. And you, leading the pack, so congratulations on all of it.

Veronica Dagher:
Thank you so much. It was so great to have you on the show. I loved your episode.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you. And you were the co-creator of it. How did you come up with it?

Veronica Dagher:
Well, we came up with it, because we knows there's enormous wealth transfer going on in the United States, with an estimated 33 trillion dollar wealth transfer happening, and women stand to control a lion's share of that money. And I looked around the marketplace, and I didn't see a whole lot of products or content, so to speak, that spoke to women in an inspirational, relatable way. So we figured, "Hey, let's do a podcast that we can connect with women by shining the light on some very famous women and what they've done to advance their own careers and make smart decisions about their money."

Veronica Dagher:
And so that's why we said, "Let's really feature women who can serve as aspirational role models for women, and, at the same time, teach them a little bit more about advancing their careers and improving their financial health."

Bobbi Rebell:
You are such a role model. A lot of your success comes from early experiences in life, and the strength that you acquired from them, and some tough times. And you're gonna share a very special money story that has to do with a loss early in your life and how that shaped your view of the world and the way that you live your life.

Veronica Dagher:
That's right. When I was 11 years old, my dad died suddenly and left my mom a widow. She was in her 40s at the time, which is younger than the average widowhood in the United States, which I think is about 59, so she was in her 40s at the time, left with an 11-year-old and a 13-year-old, my brother being the 13-year-old. And she did not understand where our accounts were. She didn't understand how to write a check. She didn't know anything about the finances of the family at all.

Veronica Dagher:
And, when my dad died, she was left scrambling. He had businesses. He had different investments. And she didn't understand any of that, and so that meant, at the worst possible time in her life, she had to learn about money and investing, learn about personal finance. And so I have these memories of her sitting at the kitchen table with some of her friends and some of my aunts, them trying to teach her, "Okay, this is how you write a check. Let's open these account statements. Let's see where these different accounts are. Let's try to understand what's happening here. Here's what you have to do in terms of deal with the business now that he's gone. Here's what you have to do with some of the accounts and the money that he was owed as a business person."

Bobbi Rebell:
Wow. So you were in it together. What was his business?

Veronica Dagher:
He was a lawyer, but he had his own law firm, and then he had several real estate holdings and some real estate interests and, also, just some other consulting type work. And so he had a lot of different tentacles to what he, day in and day out. And he had a staff and all these sorts of things as well. And so it was a lot to manage and a lot to understand, not to mention the family's personal finances and understanding the different accounts and other assets he had acquired through those years.

Veronica Dagher:
And my mom really didn't know that much about any of it, and so she had to learn, like I said, at the worst possible time, and it was a really steep, difficult learning curve for her. And there were times when financial advisors who, some of them meant well, but then some of 'em were pretty shady, try to approach her and try to get her to invest in things that were completely inappropriate.

Bobbi Rebell:
Like what? Were you aware of it at this time? Did she share with you guys what was going on, or were you kept out of it?

Veronica Dagher:
Yeah, slightly. I think a lot of it's stuff I heard, after the fact, when I was a little bit older. But I would see her crying or upset or frustrated, and just wondering what was going on. I did hear rumblings of "So-and-so tried to, you know, con me into something." Or I would hear little bits and pieces of that once in a while, or some relative would tell me and, not really fully understanding, just knowing that things at times got nasty.

Veronica Dagher:
And understanding that, sometimes, money brings out the best in people, but also the absolute worst in people as well, and that you need to be careful with who you trust and who you give your money to. Luckily, my mom had enough sense to listen to her gut instinct, even though she wasn't exactly an investing pro at the time. She had enough sense to understand who was trustworthy, who's not trustworthy. She got that part of it. And so, luckily, she didn't make any bad investments and, you know, it's not exactly always how you wanna be spending your time, but, to her credit, she learned and she would ... Even when I was a teenager, she started telling me, 'cause she was getting more savvy as each year went on. And she said, "You need to be financially savvy. You need to learn this stuff, 'cause I never want you to be in the position that I'm in."

Veronica Dagher:
And she would almost lecture me, like, "You have to be a financially independent woman. You must. You can't rely on anyone. You have to understand all this stuff." And I was like, "Oh, why is she so adamant about this?" Even though I knew the history, I felt like, "Oh, things will work out." And she was like, "No, you always need to know where everything is. You need to understand how to write that check." And I think I ... I forget how old I was when I got my first checks. I wanna say, maybe when I went to college. But she sat down with me and showed me how to write a check. She sat down with me and emphasized, "You always pay your credit card bills on time. If you don't, and if you go over a certain amount, I'm not gonna bail you out. You need to be able to pay your bill on your own. I'm not a bank. This is your responsibility."

Veronica Dagher:
She was very much focused on making me a financial grownup, as you would appreciate. And she said, when I got my first job out of college, too, she said, "You max out your 401(k). You open up that 401(k), and you contribute as much as you possibly can. You just start doing that at 21 or 22, however old you are when you get your first job."

Veronica Dagher:
And I remember thinking, "Oh, no, it's so young." And she's like, "No, you have to do it." And I listened. I said, "Okay, I'll do it." And I didn't really ... I thought everybody was doing it. And it's only after the fact that I realized not everybody got that message, unfortunately, but, luckily, she gave that message to me, and that helped me.

Bobbi Rebell:
She was a great role model.

Veronica Dagher:
Really.

Bobbi Rebell:
What is the takeaway for our listeners here?

Veronica Dagher:
I think women should really try to become financially independent. Women themselves. And take ownership of their finances, and it doesn't have to be so overwhelming. But the point is not to have to learn at the worst possible time whether that's your divorce or whether you become a widow or some other situation. Maybe you don't even get married. You can't wait around for someone else to do it for you. So start learning. Take it, piece by piece. So maybe it's 10 minutes every week you spend learning about finance. You read an article. You read a chapter of a book. You join a group that talks about money and investing.

Veronica Dagher:
You take one small step towards becoming more financially savvy, so that way you are in control of what you own and what you owe and what you're invested in, and you can become more independent as time goes on. Now, even if you don't like it, that's okay. You don't have to love everything you do. You have to brush your teeth. You may not love brushing your teeth, but it helps you feel more secure, and I think, ultimately, many women, just from some of the studies that are out there, say their biggest fear is becoming a bag lady.

Veronica Dagher:
I understand, but one way to alleviate the possibility of that happening is to take a more active role in your finances. So think about your future self. Do this for her.

Bobbi Rebell:
Such great advice. Also great advice is your everyday money tip, which we talked about before we started taping. And I'm still thinking about mine. But share with us your everyday money tip, Veronica.

Veronica Dagher:
I like the idea of having a positive money mantra, however you say it. But having a positive message you say to yourself day in, day out. So, for example, a message might be, "I am good with my money." And the reason you wanna say a positive message to yourself regularly is, there's a good chance that maybe something from your childhood has told you a negative message about yourself, and that may or may not be true.

Veronica Dagher:
And so, if you wanna create a positive, more abundant future reality, I think it's very important to have a positive mantra that you can reframe your view of yourself and your view of money. Because if you keep saying the negative, it almost becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. But if you say the positive, I think you have a much better chance of achieving the financial abundance and success that you really want.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is yours?

Veronica Dagher:
Mine is actually, "I am good with money, and I respect cash."

Bobbi Rebell:
I love that. Alright, I'm gonna give mine some thought. Before we wrap up, you have an e-book coming out. Tell us.

Veronica Dagher:
Yes. I'm super excited. We are doing an e-book based on the "Secrets of Wealthy Women" podcast here at the Wall Street Journal. And so we're profiling 20 women we've had on the podcast, talking about some of the inspirational stories that they have shared with us and giving some money and career tips, and that is slated to come out this March in e-book form on wsj.com.

Veronica Dagher:
So we're super excited about that and, hopefully, we'll have a lot more to share about that in the coming weeks, but I'm busy writing it, and I'm super excited that it's happening.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love it. I can't wait. Give us all your social channels and where people can find you besides wsj.com, which is where the e-book will be.

Veronica Dagher:
Yes. Thank you. So, on Instagram and Twitter, @veronicadagher, and on LinkedIn. I'm there as well, if you wanna contact me there. But Instagram and Twitter are the best places to get me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you, Veronica.

Veronica Dagher:
Thank you for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love all those stories. I'm still thinking about what my money mantra is going to be. Maybe everyone can share with me on social what you're thinking might be yours, at least maybe for 2019. Maybe we can all change them each year to kinda keep it fresh, but I'm thinking hard. I'll get back to you guys.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's get to our tips.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup Tip Number One: Talk to your parents about their money experiences. I was really touched by how Veronica's mom protected her from knowing everything going on when she was just too young to know everything. She obviously knew some things.

Bobbi Rebell:
But I was always so impressed that the mother-daughter relationship evolved, and her mom clearly communicated more as Veronica grew up about their experiences coping with the financial struggles connected to losing Veronica's dad at such a young age.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup Tip Number Two: If you are looking to make a meaningful impact in some aspect of your life, look to the things that shaped who you are as a financial grownup, as Veronica has done with "Secrets of Wealthy Women." Veronica not only gained strength from her experiences, after losing her father, who was the breadwinner, she has now taken that to create something that will have a much broader impact.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thanks to everyone for joining us. If you have not, please do subscribe, and, of course, tell a friend. I wanna hear what has inspired your interest in learning about money. Follow me, and please DM me your thoughts on Instagram, @bobbirebell1. On Twitter, @bobbirebell, and you can always email at hello@financialgrownup.com. And check out my new show with Stacking Benjamin's Joe Saul-Sehy. It is called "Money in the Morning." It's in all the usual podcast places, and we tape live on Facebook Live. Go to "I Stack Benjamins" on Facebook, and you can set up notifications for when we tape. We take live comments, so you can be part of the show.

Bobbi Rebell:
And we will leave a link to that in the show notes, as well.

Bobbi Rebell:
Everyone, check out "Secrets of Wealthy Women," if you have not already. Big thanks to the fabulous Veronica Dagher for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
"Financial Grownup" with Bobbie Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media Production.

Steph Paternot make a virtual fortune when the internet startup he co-founded in college, TheGlobe.com set records on its first trading day. But he and his company paid the price when his personal brand image as a brash young hard- partying entrepreneur pulled attention away from the business fundamentals. 

In Stephan's money story you will learn:

• Why it may not be a good idea to dance on tables during an interview

• Sometimes a lot of publicity isn't always the best publicity

• The documentary that CNN did on him that he and his company ended up paying the price for

In Stephan’s money lesson you will learn:

• Why you want to be careful not to overdramatize your story

• The importance of staying focused on your business

In Stephan's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Why you don't want to fall into the FOMO mentally when it comes to investing

In My Take you will learn:

• The reason that the expression "Dance like no one is watching" doesn't really work in this day and age

• Why it's so important to get back up after you fail

Check out Stephan's website -

• Slated

Follow Stephan!

• Instagram @stephanpaternot

• LinkedIn @stephanpaternot

• Twitter @stephanpaternot

• Facebook

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Steph Paternot:
The cost to me, my personal brand. The cost to the Globe brand was, "Oh I see, we got a couple crazy dotcom CEOs. We maybe shouldn't trust them. You know, maybe they're too crazy."

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup, with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. You know what, being a grown up is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay, we're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Financial Grownup friends, how much thought do you give to your personal brand? To the images that you post on social media, or that are posted about you, with you in them, that you are tagged in? Do you think it impacts your career, or your future career, your business if you're an entrepreneur, your life? What would it have been like if social media weren't even around yet, and yet you were the one creating social media? It's very meta, but so is this whole interview, because I actually interviewed our guest who was the CEO of a company called theGlobe.com, the co-founder Steph Paternot back in the dotcom boom and bust.

Bobbi Rebell:
And I remember all the buzz that he got, it wasn't always focused on his company, a lot of it was on his personal life, on his clubbing, and even what he wore when he was out of the clubs. Kind of like many young adults who are in their 20s, that was a thing that people were doing at the time, he was quite normal, except most of those other 20 somethings, I'd say pretty much all of those other 20 somethings, were not worth close to $100 million on paper.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone. If you are new, so glad you are joining us. We talk to high achievers here on the Financial Grownup podcast, they share unique money stories, and how we can learn from them, and also some every day money tips. Let's get to Steph Paternot, and the time that he and his co-founder, Todd Krizelman, were literally in college, and it should be noted that they did not drop out by the way, while they were building their company, theGlobe.com. Now they stayed in college specifically because it wasn't so clear that this internet was gonna be a thing, Steph actually said that. He really wasn't sure that the internet would be a thing that would actually be a thing.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, stay to the end to hear more about what Steph is up to now, he is disrupting a new industry, and I think you're gonna be very interested. Here is Steph Paternot. Hey Steph Paternot, you're a financial grownup, welcome to the podcast.

Steph Paternot:
Good to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
I just finished reading the re-released, new and improved, version of your book, A Very Public Offering: The Story of Theglobe.com and the First Internet Revolution, it was a total page turner, and I'm glad it got re-released, in large part because of a new series that features you, and someone playing the part of you which we'll talk about, it's a little bit weird, National Geographic series, Valley of the Boom, which I am truly enjoying. So welcome.

Steph Paternot:
Thank you.

Bobbi Rebell:
By the way, what was it like when you found out that they were casting someone to play you? Is that weird?

Steph Paternot:
Oh it was weird. I was shocked, because they had already engaged with me to come and participate in their documentary interview, and I'd already put in hours of being interviewed. In my mind it was nothing more than an expanded sort of news segment, or a documentary about the past. Since my current company, Slated, is in the film industry, I have a lot of film industry contacts, and the last thing I expected was to hear from film industry friends who were like, "Hey Steph, I just got this casting notice," I have friends who are casting directors and actors. Both parties were getting in touch with me saying, "Oh yeah so they're looking for a young, charismatic, actor to play a Steph Paternot, and another to play Mark Andreason, and a Todd Krizelman." And that's when I realized, "Oh my god I had just been pulled into something that I had no idea about."

Bobbi Rebell:
I gotta tell you Steph, your story doesn't need a whole lot of embellishment. And I'm excited about the money story that you're gonna share, because it has to do with personal branding, and the impact that can have on your financial success, or failure, of your company. And this all happened before social media was a thing. I mean you guys were inventing social media, and yet, this is kinda meta stuff I think. Tell us your money story.

Steph Paternot:
CNN decided to do a documentary on us, where they wanted to follow us, and see what the life was of a public company, dotcom CEO who's 24. And they followed Todd out to the Hamptons, where he had organized an impromptu badminton game, and a barbecue, and it was all very quaint. And then I decided, well I'll go show them what I've been doing when I need to let off steam," and that is to go clubbing, and why don't I kick it up a notch, and for once I'll wear these crazy vinyl black pants I bought, that'll make the story sexier.

Steph Paternot:
They also recorded me at my home, and one of the producers when I was off camera had asked me like, "Oh my gosh, so are you ready to live it up Steph now? I mean now that you're a billionaire are you ready to live it up?" And being that I'd grown up in England and I have a very sarcastic sense of humor, I just played along and said, "Oh yeah, absolutely, I'm ready to live a disgusting and frivolous lifestyle. That's the idea right?" And the filmed me going out to a nightclub and dancing on the tables. And I made sure really sort of to give them exactly the visual story I knew that would play well, and would be what their audience wants to believe about these dotcom days, and their juxtaposition of me dancing on the tables with this audio clip of me talking about a disgusting and frivolous lifestyle, they played that on CNN.

Steph Paternot:
Then they put that all summer long, it kept playing over and over as the hot dotcom-

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my.

Steph Paternot:
I got so much [inaudible 00:00:00] from so many people, including my partner saying, "Why would you say that? Why would you do that." I was like, "Look this is all part of building the brand of the company, and living the life that they want to imagine we live." And by the way, not for nothing, but since this has been airing we've had tens of thousands more users sign up to our site. But the cost to me, my personal brand. The cost to the Globe brand was, "Oh I see, we've got a couple crazy dotcom CEOs, we maybe shouldn't trust them." People love to look for reasons when something isn't going well, of why it's not going well. And if you give the media, or if you give an audience one reason to dislike you, or to paint you with to say why everything's going badly, then you're doing yourself a huge disservice.

Bobbi Rebell:
So Steph what is the takeaway for our listeners?

Steph Paternot:
Be careful of taking your story, or over selling, or over dramatizing, or doing something like what I did, where you gave them a cool visual and a ridiculous piece of audio. And you're giving them something they can hit you on the head with later.

Bobbi Rebell:
And do you feel it hurt your finances? Did it hurt your ability to go back for more money, and other things? Did it hurt the image? It seems like it helped to drive users to your website, but there's two sides of the business that were going on.

Steph Paternot:
Yeah, so the truth is, is that if your business fails it's not because you once wore plastic pants on a T.V. show. If your business fails, that's what people will say, because it's just easy to paint people with ... the simplest character assassination is what people like to use. But the truth is, is if your business is failing, it's usually because either your customers aren't satisfied by the product, or your advertisers are fleeing, or there's not enough revenue in the market to cover the costs of your business and your infrastructure. So the reasons theGlobe failed, ultimately, have very little to do with one particular interview segment. That just simply gave people ammunition to become haters, and troll us.

Steph Paternot:
There's so many other factors that can bring down your business. I think the takeaway her is, stay focused on your business.

Bobbi Rebell:
For your everyday money tip, you wanted to talk about an acronym that I don't know even existed back in the day, FOMO, fear of missing out.

Steph Paternot:
FOMO, I think the term got coined in the late 90s, the fear of missing out, meant that you're operating often from a place of fear. If you're seeing everyone get rich quick because they're investing in dotcoms, well then you're gonna be apt to wanna quickly invest in anything with a dotcom as well, and you're gonna throw your money at a bunch of dotcom stuff. And for a while it's probably gonna grow, and you're gonna feel okay, until you realize that you had no clue what you were investing in. And when the market craps out, you go down with it. So you don't wanna invest ever because you're seeing everyone else getting rich from a particular area.

Steph Paternot:
By the way, that just happened in 2017 with the crypto space, right. Everyone was getting into ICOs, everyone was operating from a place of fear, if you don't invest you're gonna be poor, you gotta invest.

Bobbi Rebell:
Your latest venture, Slated, tell us more about that and the other projects that you have on deck.

Steph Paternot:
I decided every movie getting made shouldn't be a miracle. There should be much more a method to the madness of filmmaking. And there's probably a much more intelligent way that people in this industry should be able to find great projects, assemble teams, find financing, and execute on their vision. And I saw this occurring in the tech space, with marketplaces like AngelList, which were making it way easier for anyone to set up a startup, find talent, find financing, discover what the growth metrics were that were important, and really grow a successful business.

Steph Paternot:
And so we took the model of AngelList, we reinvented it for the film industry, and now Slated is the leading on-line film finance marketplace. Half of all the movies that have been nominated for Academy awards the last few years are made by Slated producers, directors, writers. And we're just increasingly getting those successful filmmakers to put their next films on Slated, and getting those financed. So it took me a long time to put my CEO hat back on, and to find my passions that married film, technology, the reinvention of money on-line, and marry those all together, and really take a shot again at building a company.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well congratulations on your success throughout the decades, because you really have had such an incredible run, and you're still just beginning with new projects. Where can people find out more?

Steph Paternot:
They can find me on Twitter, @stephanpaternot, or in Instagram @stephanpaternot, or on Facebook as Stephan Paternot.

Bobbi Rebell:
If only it was at theGlobe.com, oh what could have been Steph.

Steph Paternot:
What could've been, yep.

Bobbi Rebell:
But thank you so much, this was great.

Steph Paternot:
Thanks Bobbi.

Bobbi Rebell:
What an amazing story. Financial Grownup tip number one, you know that expression, "Dance like no one is watching." So freeing, so empowering, so not realistic in this day and age, because you know everyone's watching. Unfortunately you have to live like someone is watching. Like it or not, the lines are blurring between our work and personal, and something you think you do only amongst friends could be public faster than you can click post. Act appropriate. If you have a finsta, that's a fake Instagram, I get it. Just remember, it's still out there, and you just never know.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two, if you fail, get up. Steph was down, ooh $100 million, yes it was all on paper, but it sure felt real to him. He has done so much since those days, and because he kept strong relationships with the investors that believed in him, he was able to start new businesses, new investments, and have new success. Keep an eye on Steph, and his film finance business Slated, I expect to continue to see big things, lots of disruption happening in that industry.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you for all of your support, of not just Financial Grownup, but my new podcast, Money in the Morning with Joe Saul-Sehy of Stacking Benjamins fame. Truly appreciate if you tell your friends, and subscribe to both. And big thanks to Steph Paternot for helping us all get one step close to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbie Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Wander Wealthy’s Tess Wicks shares her early interest in investing in the stock market, how Warren Buffett inspired her, the advice her family gave her and what got her to actually make her first investment. Her every day money tip will resonate with fans of Marie Kondo who are tired of feeling overwhelmed by their belongings. 

In Tess' money story you will learn:

• The reason she felt like she was starting to invest late at the age of 22

• What Dollar Cost Averaging is and why you might want to invest this way

• Why investing may feel overcomplicated, but it can actually be really easy

In Tess’ money lesson you will learn:

• You may never feel ready but it's important to just jump in anyway

• Why the younger you start investing, the better it is for you in the long run

In Tess' everyday money tip you will learn:

• How creating a capsule wardrobe can not only help you save money, but may bring more joy to your life in the spirit of Marie Kondo

In My Take you will learn:

• Why it's important to realize that you must actually start the clock in order to have time on your side

• Just because you have a lot of space for more stuff, that doesn't mean you need to fill that space with stuff

Episode Links:

Learn more about Value Investing!

Financial Grownup Guest Danielle Town is one of my favorite resources.

This is a great piece on value investing from one of my favorite websites Investopedia!

Check out Tess' Invested program and website -

• The Invested Program

• Wander Wealthy

Follow Tess!

• Instagram

• LinkedIn

• Twitter

• Facebook

• YouTube

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Tess Wicks:
After doing that it opened up the whole world of money to me; it really helped me see the possibility of money and what's really important here is that you don't need to be ready, you don't need to know all of the facts, you just have to dive in.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of "How to be a Financial Grownup" and you know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay, we're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grown-up, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Financial Grownup friends, we are going global here at Financial Grownup to Italy for this episode, virtually of course. It is a podcast, come on guys, you know we weren't really going.

Bobbi Rebell:
Tess Wicks, you may know her from her blog, her podcast and her super fun, and honestly, extremely informative and educational, YouTube channel, all under the brand, Wonder Wealthy. She moved to Italy for love, but she's also building her own entrepreneurial venture which we talk about in our interview. Tess is someone that I've been impressed with for quite some time from afar, and I was really excited to get to talk to her about her proactive approach to investing and creating systems so that we can all stay on track to meet our financial goals. Very appropriate for the beginning of the year, even if you do something you never plan to do like move to Europe. No excuses, just different opportunities. Here is Tess Wicks.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Tess Wicks, you're a financial grown-up, welcome to the podcast.

Tess Wicks:
Thank you so much Bobbi. I'm so excited to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well I'm excited that you're here because I am such a fan of Wander Wealthy, which is your brand, it is on YouTube, where you're ... I'm sorry to use this term, but you're so adorable. You have buddy tips that even I don't know which is truly brilliant, and of course you have your podcast, so congratulations on it all.

Tess Wicks:
Thank you so much, it's really wonderful to hear coming from you, someone who's been on TV, now doing radio podcast stuff.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well you're a natural of all of it, and you have so many great things in the works and I'm gonna give a little teaser after your money story and everyday money tip. We're gonna give everyone a sneak peek to something new that they can be a part of. But first let's get to your money story which is really appropriate because here we are, we're taping this in January, this has been a very stressful and a bit of a rollercoaster ride for anyone that is interested in investing and the stock market, and it's something that even I find a bit overwhelming, whether or not to put new money in, what to do with the money that you have. Your money story has to do with a big decision you made to just get started, go for it.

Tess Wicks:
Yes, absolutely so I started investing right out of college and that to me felt late because I was majoring in Actuarial Science and Finance in college, so I was supposed to be the money expert here, I supposed to know my stuff and I remember going through my portfolio, investing class in college, I think it was my senior year, it was full of just guys and they all seemed like they knew what they were doing, and I was so confused but I knew that investing was something that people did, especially wealthy people, and someone I really looked up to, well first when I was younger, was my brother who is seven years older than me and he started investing when he was 12, so I was very behind compared to him. And I would ask my dad all the time about investing and he would try and explain it to me while we were driving in his truck and I just never could get it. And then of course college happened and then I started looking up to Warren Buffet cos one of my professors made us read us every single one of his letters to shareholders for Berkshire Hathaway. So if you know anything about Warren Buffet, then you're probably a fan too.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, he is all about value investing. We'll leave some links to help you look and learn about value investing and Warren Buffett.

Tess Wicks:
Yes, so I actually remember so I was sitting, we had this little TV room that all the kids would pile into, I'm one of four, when I was little. And I'm sitting there after college and I'm about to leave on a big, not around the world, but I was going to go on a trip to New Zealand to [inaudible 00:04:35] myself solo, traveling the world, and I was but I know there's something I need to do first, and that was to make my first investment.

Tess Wicks:
And I had no idea where to start. All I knew was wealthy people invested. I asked my brother how to open up an investment account, and he was "Just choose one, Saber, Vanguard, whatever." I basically knew that I needed to invest in, or I thought what would be good and smart for me at the time, was to invest in some sort of index mimicking, exchange traded fund or a mutual fund. So those were all that I knew.

Tess Wicks:
And the thing and the reason that I wanted to tell this story is that I just did it. I didn't even know what the stock market looked like at the time; I didn't know a lot about investing, but I just did it. I was 22 years old and I just did it. After doing that, it opened up the whole world of money to me; it really helped me see the possibilities of money and what's really important here is that you don't need to be ready, you don't need to know all of the facts, you just have dive in, and especially when you are young, you have that time.

Bobbi Rebell:
What is the one thing that happened that finally pulled the trigger on it for you?

Tess Wicks:
There wasn't one thing except this build up of pressure of saying, I'm supposed to know this stuff, so I'm just gonna do it so I can get that experience, and maybe once I get the experience, I'll figure it out after that.

Bobbi Rebell:
And did you put systems in place? Did you put in any kind of automatic investing? Dollar cost averaging? What's been your general system since then?

Tess Wicks:
Okay, well at that time no. I had saved up a chunk of money during my internship during school, and was like, I know this is enough to open an account so I'm gonna go, and at that time, nothing, I literally let that investment stay put and I never really touched it until two or three years later. But in that two or three year timeframe, after I got back from my summer trip and I started my work full-time, my brother, the investing guru had told me about [Roble 00:06:40] advisors and I actually opened a Roble advisor account and then I started regularly investing in that, along with of course my 401 cape through my employers. So I was taking advantage of dollar cost averaging which is just investing on a regular basis, once a month I think, was my timeline and I had set a couple of goals cos with Roble advisors you can do that as well. I knew I wanted to invest for the long term because I want to be really rich in 20, 30, 40 years, and I think I wanted to buy an investment property. I was very future oriented when I was 22, so that's what I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
And what is your takeaway for our listeners, especially those who are sitting here, knowing like you did that they should be investing but they're watching the market and they're thinking, well I don't want to put money into a market that keeps going down. As we're taping here, I have a screen to the side of me and the market is down today again.

Tess Wicks:
Yes, okay so first of all, anything you wanna do, when it comes to money or anything else, you never are going to feel ready, you just have to jump in. So that's my one, number one of that, is just, you just have to suck it up. But if you're looking at the market specifically, something that I realized, and there's a lot of historical data and different reports that you can look up about this, is if you miss 10 or 20 of the best trading days in the market, in a 15 year increment, your returns get cut significantly. The thing is, we don't know when those best trading days are going to be. It could be literally tomorrow so if you get in today you can capture a really great trading day tomorrow. But we don't know when that's going to happen, so the best time to get invested is when you just have money and you are financially capable to be investing, meaning you have an emergency savings fund, your high interest debt is being taken care of, hopefully paid off, and now you feel financially able to put some money into the market.

Tess Wicks:
And the younger you are, the better, because the longer timeframe you have to maybe have those investments lose a little bit of money, and then maybe make some money and of course at the end of the day the trend has historically been upwards so if you can do that, you should be okay.

Bobbi Rebell:
Your everyday money tip is genius because you, for those folks who don't know that much about you, you moved across the world to Italy for love, and when you move you can't bring everything but that's a good thing when it comes to your everyday money tip, go for it.

Tess Wicks:
Yeah my everyday money tip is to create a capsule wardrobe or if you want to be more general, you can just downsize, whether it's your wardrobe or the things in your house. Even if you have a lot of space for stuff, I find that when we downsize and we make it a high priority to find things that we love to keep in our home, we're then able to save more money by setting some really high requirements for what we bring into our lives. And it just makes you way more aware about the things you already have, how you can make good use of them, and when you feel like you're tempted to spend, you'll probably second guess a lot of the time and then you won't necessarily spend as much money.

Bobbi Rebell:
Which is a good thing, especially when so many pieces are in motion.

Bobbi Rebell:
You have a new program starting this winter that I think is a really innovative approach to what we just talked about, to investing and to making sure to put yourself and your future and the money you'll have in the future, as a priority. Tell us more about the Invested Program.

Tess Wicks:
Yeah so the Invested Program is a six module program where I give you the information that you need but also the steps that you can take and implement in your life to create a personalized prudent investment strategy for yourself. Now I'm a big index investor kind of girl. I like to base my investment strategy off of research, especially Nobel Prize winning research and theories that have worked in the past.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're so intense Tess! Oh my God!

Bobbi Rebell:
Sorry, keep going. Oh my gosh.

Tess Wicks:
That's what I like to teach cos I want people to feel confident that they know what they're doing. Cos I think what holds you back lots of times especially when it comes to investing, is it is just way over complicated by the media, by a lot of people on Wall Street, even by your Great Uncle Gary. You think, oh my gosh I can never figure out what's gonna be good or what's gonna be bad, and it's scary when things are unclear and when you don't have that confidence. So in the program I really try and fill people with confidence and give them the things they need to know and how investing can actually be really easy. And then on top of that, I have a live bonus module where you get to watch me invest twice a week, from here til in the future, so you can see me putting the strategies I teach into action and I think that really helps people gain confidence and see that it really does work.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well it also gives you the confidence that even though the market can be such a rollercoaster, that doesn't mean you can't control your investments and still make it work for you.

Tess Wicks:
Exactly and there is obviously very important criteria that you'll put in place for yourself to meet your needs.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love that. And I love the fact that you do so much of the research behind the scenes and then filter it down and then deliver exactly what people need to know, and not everything. Because as you said, sometimes things are made so complicated that we just can't get it done; it's just not happening because there's too much.

Tess Wicks:
Yes absolutely.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay Tess, tell us where we can learn more about the Investor program and you and Wander Wealthy and all the things.

Tess Wicks:
Yes, so you can find all of my content at Wonderwealthy.com. There's links to my YouTube channel, to the podcast and if you wanna learn more about the Invested program, it's actually gonna officially launching early February, but you can get into, I have a free investing bootcamp; it's ten days, you get e-emails and we start getting you into the investing world, and you can go to Wonderwealthy.com/invest to sign up.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love that, and I love that you feel like you are part of a team and a group and that gets you motivated, because sometimes in the new year, we have all of those goals, we need that. We need to feel that accountability.

Tess Wicks:
Yes.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Tess Wicks, thank you so much. Love it all. I'll keep watching Wander Wealthy and I love your podcast and I'm excited to see the Invested Program. Thank you.

Tess Wicks:
Thanks so much Bobbi.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right friends, lets get right to it. Here is my take. Financial Grownup tip, number one: time is only on your side if you actually start the clock. Now this is one clock we all want to be ticking. Saving money is not enough as Tess points out. There is never gonna be an obvious time to start investing, so you have to start. Make sure to invest the money that you have allocated to investing; no sitting on the sidelines for every. You can wait a little. I would say if you're cautious, dollar cost invest, averaging everything out to smooth the ups and downs, that means putting a set amount of money into the market at set intervals so that you don't get the highs and lows. You also don't get all the highs when you're avoiding the lows, but so be it. The point is, start the clock, start the timer, get going, just like Tess says.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two: I love that Tess talked about downsizing our stuff and most of us have too much, that's the truth of it, which is so appropriate given that many of us are watching the [inaudible 00:14:23] Show on Tidying up on Netflix. Just because you have enough space for more stuff and you're not going abroad like Tess is, doesn't mean that you need to buy and keep things to fill all the space. Make sure you know where things are. That's something I have a hard time with myself even though I live in an apartment, I put things away in a safe place and then I don't know where they are. And then you know what happens? You can't find it and you buy another one. And then what happens? You find the original item. So lets all work towards getting past that and only having the things we want, need or see a need for realistically in the future, getting more organized so we don't buy things we already have.

Bobbi Rebell:
I would love to hear from you about your experience, your first experience investing or if it hasn't happened yet, what is keeping you from it? And how can we all get started, finding our starting line and getting things going? Be in touch on all the socials, at Instagram at bobbirebell1, on Twitter at Bobbi Rebell, my Facebook page is Bobbi Rebbell and you can email me at Hello@FinancialGrownup.com. And by the way, I mention my Facebook page because something interesting is happening on Facebook, specifically Facebook Live with a new project that I have been alluding to a little bit here. I've talked about it a couple of times, but if you have not already, please check out my new podcast, a second podcast, Financial Grownup's not going anywhere, it is called Money in the Morning, it is with my dear friend Joe Saul-Sehy, you may know him from Stacking Benjamin's fame. We tape live on the Stacking Benjamin's Facebook page at IstackBenjamins and there is audience participation.

Bobbi Rebell:
So I hope you guys will join us, we read your comments live and it's a really really fun thing to do if you have some time. We're gonna start posting a specific schedule in advance there and I'll also be sure to share it on my socials as well. And big thanks to the inspiring Tess Wicks of Wanderwealthy for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grown-ups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grown-up with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

When payroll is coming directly out of your bank account, every penny is precious. For entrepreneur Vic Drabicky that laser focus on costs, held back growth for January Digital, until he started to see the real cost of his fiscal frugality. 

In Vic's money story you will learn:

• Why Vic's conservative approach lead him to losing a big client

• What he did to turn things around

• Why it's so important to invest in the right leadership

In Vic’s money lesson you will learn:

• "Pinching pennies is fine, but you better pinch the right ones"

• Why it's important, when looking at investments, to see which ones yield the highest return

In Vic's everyday money tip you will learn:

• What the "plan your work, work your plan" strategy is

In My Take you will learn:

• Doing one thing at a time can help to prevent from becoming overwhelmed

• Sometimes there is no perfect answer but be prepared to pivot when your views change

Check out Vic's website

January Digital

Follow Vic!

• Instagram

• LinkedIn

• Twitter

• Facebook

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Vic Drabicky:
... a lot of panic and, holy cow, what are we going to do? I got a whole lot more gray hairs and a whole lot less sleep as we navigated through that.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell. Author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. And you know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Happy January, everyone. In this case, January Digital. The marketing agency was named in honor of the month that celebrates new beginnings for so many of us, including its founder, Vic Drabicky. Love his story, and you will too. Such inspiration for the new year.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome, everyone. New listeners, so glad you're here. Welcome back to our regulars. Episodes are short so you can stack them back to back for however much time you have to spend with us. And if you like what we're doing, tell a friend and DM us your feedback. I am @bobbirebell1 on Instagram, bobbirebell on Twitter, and you can email us at hello@financialgrownup.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Get ready to say hello to our guest, Vic Drabicky. He and his company, January Digital, have worked with amazing brands. Think Fenty by Rihanna, Diane von Furstenberg, Oscar de la Renta, Vineyard Vines, and Kendra Scott. But January Digital's first year was rocky because they didn't invest enough in themselves. Big lessons here, and Vic's tip at the end about how companies and people can get attention on social media without hiring a big company like January Digital is pure gold.

Bobbi Rebell:
Listen to this man. Here is January Digital's Vic Drabicky.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Vic Drabicky. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Vic Drabicky:
Thank you very much. Thanks for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Congratulations on the success of your digital marketing company, January Digital. By the way this is airing of course in January, so it's perfect timing. Tell us quickly about the name.

Vic Drabicky:
Yeah. So we are a full frontal digital agency. What that means is brands, primarily luxury brands and beauty brands, come to us and say, "Look I've got this money and I need to advertise my brand digitally. I don't know how to do it. Can you do it for me?" And that's everything from working with folks like Vogue and influencers all the way down to the tactical paid search and SEO and sort of the nerdy parts of digital marketing as well. So kind of top to bottom.

Bobbi Rebell:
Where did the name January Digital come from? I mean, digital makes sense. But why January?

Vic Drabicky:
January 1st, if you're poor you're going to be rich. If you're fat your going to be thin. You can do absolutely anything in January. So that theme of renewal and rebirth was really important for me, and important for us in the way that we approach things for our company. It's different than the traditional way too, so that's how it kind of fits together.

Bobbi Rebell:
And also a perfect transition to your money story that you brought, because it has to do with the birth of the company. Which of course you were ambitious, but you were also very conservative to the point where it came to bite you. Tell us your money story, Vic.

Vic Drabicky:
Yeah, absolutely. Everybody that knows me knows I tend to be fiscally conservative. I mean, some would say cheap. I think very calculated. But what happened is we were very lucky early on and our company grew really fast. We went from something like nine people to 32 or 33 over the course of just a couple months. Which was phenomenal and great, but I still had the mindset of, okay, let me make sure that I conserve the profit that we have. Because I started the company with no venture capital, not even a loan. So it was right out of my bank account, which was relatively small.

Bobbi Rebell:
So you were paying these people, I mean, you had to hit payroll every month on your bank account.

Vic Drabicky:
Exactly right.

Bobbi Rebell:
I'd be pretty careful with that money then.

Vic Drabicky:
Well, right, and that's what you would think, right? This is my money. If I pay these people too much or hire too much, I don't get paid. And then, well, you know, that affects my family and my rent and my kids and all of those sorts of things. And so I took this really conservative approach, even when we were growing really quickly. And what that led me to was hiring folks who tended to be probably a little bit younger and a little bit cheaper. And I was probably a little bit arrogant, thinking, you know what, I've done enough of this; I can figure it out. I can teach them all how to do this and I can be a great leader.

Vic Drabicky:
But when ended up happening in the end is I underinvested in leadership. And because of that, the people that were on my staff all of a sudden, the 30-something people were looking towards me and some of them weren't that happy. And some of them weren't great hires. And that led to our work product being a little meh at times. And then clients felt that. And the year following that extensive growth is where we actually saw the hardest quarter ever, where we had clients and people leave at a rate that we've never seen ever in the history of our company.

Bobbi Rebell:
So you actually lost a big client. What was that discussion like when they pulled the plug?

Vic Drabicky:
Well, a lot of panic and, holy cow, what are we going to do? And by that time I was lucky enough to have added a couple people to my executive team around me who were accepting of my panic. But also did a great job of sitting down and going, okay, listen, we have been conservative for this long so we have a little bit to fall back on. And I have a great board member from the financial field who helped make sure we secured rainy day funding and things like that just in case something happened.

Vic Drabicky:
So by that point we were okay and we could get through. I got a whole lot more gray hairs and a whole lot less sleep as we navigated through that. But with the help of those guys, we were able to get through it. We were able to stop and say, okay, clearly identify what the problem was: not enough leadership, not enough skill. Let's put together a plan and put together a calculated risk on where we're going to invest against those. And we know that if we're right, that this sort of downturn ... we're only going to really feel the hurt from this for the next quarter or quarter and a half. So if we have this right, then this is a short-term thing when you compare it to the life of a company.

Vic Drabicky:
So for us, we were able to make those decisions. We were able to hold on and stick together. And I'll say that since then, our company has grown at a rate much faster than it originally had, and we've invested in right leadership. And so now our retention rates both for employees and clients are at all-time highs. Our profit margin has steadily increased quarter over quarter over quarter for a year and a half straight. So that investment that we ended up making at that time in leadership, which corrected our original mistake, has really paid off for us.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is your takeaway that you would offer to the listeners so that they could apply this to their businesses, but also to their lives when it comes to investing? Because we do want to be careful with our money.

Vic Drabicky:
Absolutely. So for me it's ... the saying that we've coined is, pinching pennies is fine, but you better pinch the right ones. The idea is is that a lot of people look at finances and expenses on a sheet and say: where can I make sure my costs stay in line? But what people rarely do is look at it and go: what investment yields me the highest return?

Vic Drabicky:
And the reason I think most people do that is the first one is easy. You put it on a spreadsheet and you go, oh, my people cost me $10, my office costs me 2 ... unless you're in New York then it costs 8 ... and people look at this and that's a very easy thing to move around. But understanding what the profit you're going to get from that investment is much harder and much more nebulous.

Vic Drabicky:
So instead, if you're able to take that spreadsheet and still have it ... add an extra column in the end that goes, okay if I spend these $10 on these people, I'm going to make 20. If I spend this $8 on technology, I'm going to make 22. Okay, that might actually be the better one. So as long as you have that end goal next to it, it allows you to ensure you're pinching the right pennies.

Bobbi Rebell:
But if you're being honest with yourself, Vic, looking back, do you think that as a startup entrepreneur, self-funding, which is huge, could you have, even now looking back, really stomached hiring expensive people? It's hard to really do, right?

Vic Drabicky:
Yeah. It's extremely hard to do. You know, I think one of the things that's great about not having funding is you don't owe anybody any growth. And so when you don't owe anybody growth, you don't have to take on a deal that maybe your people don't like or maybe you don't like just to hit your growth goals. You can take on things that are really true to the mission of what you want, or what you want to accomplish. And so if that mission of what you want to accomplish is a really good one, then not having that funding allows you to stay true to that and you'll still eventually succeed.

Vic Drabicky:
So there's that side. But on the other side of it, again, having the risk of my bank account being zero if things went bad is an awfully hefty risk. So I still haven't figured out exactly if I would have changed it or not, but I'm very happy to be where we are now.

Bobbi Rebell:
Fair enough. All right. Let's talk about your everyday money tip. Because this is something that is relatable to so many people but yet we don't do. Go for it.

Vic Drabicky:
Yeah. Plan your work, work your plan. Finances more than almost any other part of your business, I think, is something that you have to have a plan around. You absolutely have to sit down, write out what you want to accomplish, write out what it takes, write out what the costs are, all the cost centers, all of those sorts of things. You have to do that. Once you have that plan down, then you work against that.

Vic Drabicky:
Inevitably, what you'll find out is that your plan on day one is slightly outdated on day two, and is really outdated by day 365. But what happens is if you have that plan and you're constantly working against it and you tweak, versus having no plan and trying to resolve everything as it comes out, you're going to be significantly more successful. This works both at home and in the office.

Vic Drabicky:
In the office we have something that we run. We always have our plan for the entire year, then we have our forecast which shows what our trend is, and we have our actuals. And we always keep the plan steady; we never touch it. January 1st it's set in stone. We don't touch it. The forecast we adjust, and obviously the actuals we put in each month.

Vic Drabicky:
But I actually do the same thing at home. I'm very lucky to have married a very talented woman who owns an interior design firm. The great thing about that is she's extremely talented; the bad thing about that means our house is under construction every day for the entire year. It's sort of running on the fly, but what we do is at the beginning of the year we sit down and go, here are all the projects we want to get done for this year. Let's write them down then we can start prioritizing against them, and then we can start figuring out which ones we actually can accomplish, which ones we can't.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's talk a little bit more about January Digital and the work that you do there. Explain to me, what is the challenge? Because it's kind of a moving target, digital marketing. And you work with some brands that have ... some are newer brands, some are older brands. Like you work with David's Bridal; that's got to be challenging. You work with Kendra Scott, one of my favorite jewelry lines. Tell me more.

Vic Drabicky:
Yeah, so I mean, it definitely is. Our primary focus is on retail, luxury, and beauty. So most of our clients fit within that. Not all of them. David's Bridal being a good example of one that, you know, from the outside you might look at it and go, okay, that's an interesting brand but it doesn't sound near as sexy as working with Tory Burch or J.Crew or-

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly. So how do you do that? Right.

Vic Drabicky:
What I think is great about what we've been able to do is that we are very good at making sure what we want to accomplish with our clients aligns very well with what they want us to accomplish for them. That sounds very simplistic, but I think a lot of times clients look at agencies and think of them as this mysterious entity over there that they're going to kick work to, and every year they're just going to [inaudible 00:11:16] to make sure that their fees go down. And we're very clear going in to people saying, no, that's not what we want. And we as an agency are going to invest in you. We're going to put people in your offices to make sure we know you and your brand and everything you want to accomplish.

Vic Drabicky:
And what that does is that really aligns both of us not as two separate entities but as one team trying to accomplish things. And whenever you have that as your base, it doesn't matter if you're selling dresses or jewelry. When you have that at your core, your opportunity to succeed is significantly higher. And that's what we've seen. And that's why our client retention rate is north of 90 percent versus the industry average, which is below 70 percent.

Bobbi Rebell:
So if you were starting out as an entrepreneur in general, not someone that is a digital marketing agency, but if you're just trying to get attention online, get your brand noticed, do you have any tips for people that aren't at the level where they can hire an agency?

Vic Drabicky:
I still think one of the more underused techniques is to use LinkedIn to advertise your business. You can go in and very quickly advertise against prospects that you want to talk to. You can very quickly advertise against audiences, those sorts of things. And if you have truly valuable content that you want to share, it's a really cheap, easy way to go in and start being very ... test the waters to see how your message is resonating.

Vic Drabicky:
For those that are not in a service industry but maybe you're selling a product, maybe you're a jeweler, or whatever it might be. What I always tell people is start small and then iterate really quickly. There are sort of the basics of digital marketing that always start with Google search, then you can move on to Facebook. But just do one piece at a time.

Vic Drabicky:
If you can do one piece at a time and figure out how to do it well, what happens is it becomes very predictable. And so now all of a sudden every morning when you wake up, you know Google's going to make you $10 and Facebook is going to make you 2. Okay so if your goal for the day was only to make $15, you don't have to worry about those 12. You only have to worry about selling the last 3. And that simplifies [inaudible 00:13:07] problems down and allows you to focus on the areas that you need to solve versus the ones that are consistent and will deliver every day.

Bobbi Rebell:
Such valuable advice. Thank you so much. Okay, now that you have a website, tell us where we can go and where we can follow January Digital and you on social.

Vic Drabicky:
Sure. januarydigital.com is the website. Please don't judge us too much; while we think it looks great, we still have a lot of work to do. And then, quite honestly, we do a ton on LinkedIn. I try to post relatively regularly on LinkedIn. Our company does as well. We include content that everyone from our newest employees who are just out of school all the way up to people who have been here six, seven years, we allow them to post content quite a bit that we find valuable. And we share it all pretty openly too, so ... Those are the areas that I think we're probably most active. Obviously we're still on Facebook and things like that too. But that's probably the best area to get to us.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you, Vic. This was great.

Vic Drabicky:
Absolutely. I appreciate you having me. And congratulations on all your success as well.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right, my friends. Let's get right to it. Financial grownup tip number one. Focus. I get overwhelmed by all the things I want to learn, and Vic makes a great point about learning about new things but maybe focus on one thing at a time. I'm going to take that advice myself.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two. There is no right answer when you're starting a new venture, personal or business. So be prepared to pivot. Vic knows, looking back, that he aimed too low in his hiring. But also admits that his reason for doing so made sense at the time. And he still sees why they made sense, even in retrospect. So in life and in business, part of being a financial grownup is accepting that sometimes there is no perfect answer. Let's say Vic had stretched and had hired more expensive and more experienced people from the get-go; that also had risks. He did what he thought was best at the time and then when it wasn't, he course-corrected.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Thanks everyone for joining us. If you like the podcast and enjoy it, don't forget to subscribe. And we really appreciate ratings and reviews on Apple Podcasts or anywhere. All feedback is good. And big thanks to January Digital's Vic Drabicky for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Taxes are never fun but millions of Americans may pay less for 2018. David Rae CFP® joins Bobbi for a breakdown of what changes matter and specific things Financial Grownups can do to make sure they are on track for when it is time to turn in their returns this spring. 

Here are 5 tips for year end tax planning

• Max out your retirement accounts

• Set up the Right Retirement Plan for your business

• Strategically Bunch your Tax Deductions

• Consider Doner-Advised Funds

• Tax-Loss Harvesting

Wealth coach Adeola Omole got a do-over she didn’t want when she got laid off a second time- but by being financially prepared she was able to land on her feet. The author of “7 Steps to get out of Debt and Build Wealth” shares her story of how she came out stronger the second time around. 

In Adeola's money story you will learn:

• How she prepared herself for a second lay-off

• What the Super-Charged Financial Strategy is and how it helped her to pay off $70,000 in consumer debt in less than 3 years

• Why you should negotiate interest rate reductions

In Adeola’s money lesson you will learn:

• What she did to layoff proof her life

• Why debt is the only thing that holds you back from living the life you want

In Adeola's everyday money tip you will learn:

• What it means to triple-check your way to wealth and why it's important

In My Take you will learn:

• Why no ask is too great when negotiating interest rate reductions

• Why it's so important to pay attention to what's going on in your industry on an economic level

Adeola has generously sent, from Canada no less, two signed copies of her book 7 Steps To Get Out of Debt and Build Wealth to give away- all you have to do it DM me your takeaway from this episode- bobbirebell1 on instagram bobbirebell on twitter or email us at hello@financialgrownup.com

Episode Links:

Check out Adeola's website - https://www.adeolaomole.com/

Adeola's book 7 Steps to Get Out of Debt and Build Wealth

Follow Adeola!

• Instagram

• Twitter

• Facebook

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Adeola Amole:
Because of my first layoff experience I actually created my entire career to layoff-proof my life. In essence, I built up my asset base so I have these rental properties that are cashflow positive, I have money coming in from my investments from the stock market. I really had already set myself up to take care of that subconsciously.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner Bobbi Rebell, author of How To Be a Financial Grownup. You know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. It's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We've got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, financial grownups. No matter how much we talk about being ready for something like a layoff who really is? Right? For today's guest, wealth coach, author, social worker and lawyer, Adeola Amole, getting laid off for the second time still caught her off-guard even though the signs were all there.

Bobbi Rebell:
This time she was a lot better prepared and I think you are going to be very interested in what she did to layoff-proof her life. It was not just having an emergency fund, although that also matters a lot.

Bobbi Rebell:
Happy holidays to everyone and special welcome to our newest listeners. So glad you found us. We keep the episodes on the short side, about 15 minutes, with the idea that you can stack a few together to fill the time that you have to listen. Feel free to listen to a few episodes at a time if that's what works for you.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Let's get back to Adeola. She is also the author of a really readable book and I don't take that lightly because it is true to the title 7 Steps To Get Out of Debt and Build Wealth in that she really walks us through exactly what to do. Action steps, not just theories. She comes from experience as you will hear in our interview. Here is Adeola Amole.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Adeola Amole. You are a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Adeola Amole:
Thank you for having me, Bobbi.

Bobbi Rebell:
We practiced saying your name because I am terrible at pronunciation. I just want to say for people curious about the name Adeola Amole it is of Nigerian origin. I just learned this. It means crown of wealth, which we love, so welcome.

Adeola Amole:
Well, thank you. Yeah. No. I love it.

Bobbi Rebell:
You are the author of 7 Steps To Get Out of Debt and Build Wealth. You are a money coach but by trade your background is as a lawyer and you have a graduate degree in social work. You know a lot about a lot of things.

Adeola Amole:
Well, thank you for that. I like to think that I'm a person who just wants to learn and I love learning about so many different things as my background shows. Now I'm living my passion. This wealth coaching thing is right up my alley. I also am able to still use the legal background as well as the social work background. It marries brilliantly.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's get to your money story. It has to do with the art of the do-over. Let's call it that. Go for it.

Adeola Amole:
I got laid off and I literally had no backup plan, no clue how to do it. Long story short, I figured out a strategy. I call it the Super-Charged Financial Strategy. I figured out how to pay it all off and luckily for me [crosstalk 00:03:30]

Bobbi Rebell:
We should say you had quite a bit ... You had $70,000 in consumer debt when you suddenly had no income of your own and your husband had a smaller income. You had the larger income.

Adeola Amole:
Exactly. You are absolutely correct. $70,000 was paid off in the first three years of the plan. Just shy of three years.

Bobbi Rebell:
What is the plan? When you say the plan what is the plan?

Adeola Amole:
The Super-Charged Financial Strategy is a two-part plan. The first part of the strategy I call it the Super-Charged Debt Repayment Plan and that literally is the snowball method on super-charged. Hence, the fact that I call it the Super-Charged Plan.

Bobbi Rebell:
Because you would pay but you would also negotiate a lot with the credit card companies.

Adeola Amole:
Exactly. I would negotiate like crazy. This is where the legal background truly did pay off because I literally knew ... I setup the system for myself and I knew exactly what processes I would have to use. If I didn't get what I wanted from the rep I would just ask to speak with a manager and usually got what I wanted. I knew how to negotiate myself to as low a rate as possible.

Bobbi Rebell:
What I love about this is you at times went for the 8% or 9% but you even went for 0% sometimes. You can ask for that. It's a little bit bold, you won't always succeed, but you can ask for 0%.

Adeola Amole:
Exactly. It works. It helps you crush that debt faster.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. You had the first layoff. You learned from the idea of not being prepared. Then life goes on, you get a new job, the recession, we move past the recession, past that 18 months of being unemployed, things are good, you now have a child, your husband is home now taking care of the child. What happens next?

Adeola Amole:
Yeah. To add onto that story we have a child but now we have two rental properties. We have money in the markets. We built up assets after having paid off the $70,000 consumer debt. Now things are looking fabulous, my husband is a stay-at-home dad. He's been with our son for four years.

Adeola Amole:
Then we get pregnant with a second child but I didn't tell my employer this because most women know this, first trimester you just stay hush hush until you go into the second trimester. Long story short, I get laid off again.

Bobbi Rebell:
Had you had any idea this was coming?

Adeola Amole:
No. Well, I shouldn't say no. What happened is I worked in an industry where it was really contingent on oil prices. Oil prices had just crashed. This was I believe last quarter of 2014. I was in a position where we got rumors as to, "Things aren't looking so good. Oil is going down." People talked about it but no one knew that it was going to happen. We had suspicions but obviously I didn't think I was going to be one of them.

Bobbi Rebell:
Do you feel looking back you had a sense of denial maybe about it?

Adeola Amole:
Absolutely. Absolutely. However, I have to tell you because of my first layoff experience I actually created my entire career to layoff-proof my life. In essence, I built up my asset base so I had these rental properties that were cashflow positive. I had money coming in from my investments from the stock market. I really had already set myself up to take care of that subconsciously.

Bobbi Rebell:
Excellent. What happens?

Adeola Amole:
Yeah. I'm laid off. My employer at the time doesn't know that I'm three months pregnant. I should have been absolutely terrified but I wasn't because, as I said, we set ourselves up. We had cashflow in properties. We had investment properties.

Adeola Amole:
My husband and I were figuring out what to do next and we had five months to think about it. Guess what? There was money to take care of everything. We had a 12 month emergency plan. It was really my financial do-over.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love that. What is your advice for our listeners? What's the takeaway here?

Adeola Amole:
The biggest takeaway is, guys, plan for these what ifs. These what ifs it's not if they're going to happen. It's when they're going to happen. It's best to just put a plan of action in place. Crush that debt. Like get it off your plate, get it off your balance sheet.

Adeola Amole:
At the end of the day, that's what's holding you back from really creating the life that you want to live. If you get that out of the way you can truly start planning where you want to go.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. You brought with you a great everyday money tip that's something we kind of all should know but we just ... I don't do it. I totally take the short way and I'm sure I've made so many bad decisions, I know I have, because of it. Teach us.

Adeola Amole:
You're awesome. The tip that I have is triple-check your way to wealth. It's a really simple tip and it's something that you can totally use today and it means that when you're looking for any item, like any big ticket item, even a little ticket item, always at least refer to three merchants or three service providers for pricing and also for service. This is boiling down to people as well as prices. I think it matters to work with good people. I always want to work with good people. I always want to get the best prices.

Adeola Amole:
I recently had some auto body work that I had to do. I was referred to one company and when I called them ... They're a reputable company and I've heard about them so I knew that they were good ... I called the service provider and they set a price that sounded wonky to me. It was like $3800 to get this done. I literally almost lost my mind.

Adeola Amole:
I thought, "Okay, let's just call around" so I called a few other folks, got some references. Long story short, after doing the check I found an incredible company, extremely reputable, used by the best dealerships where I live, and they came up with a price that was just $1000 shy of the price so it was $2800. The people were incredible, they were extremely friendly, and because I'm a lawyer I decided I'm going to negotiate an even better rate.

Adeola Amole:
I spoke with the guy and told him, "Okay, what can we do here? I really want to go with you, I really like you guys. What more can you do for me?" Sure enough he gave me $200 less than it was originally quoted. $2600 and change. Long story short, guys, triple-check your way to wealth. That extra money now can go into my investment portfolio.

Bobbi Rebell:
What is your favorite go-to source for even finding vendors or people that you can work with? Sometimes it's really hard just to get referrals.

Adeola Amole:
It's the truth. It depends on what it is. In this instance, because it was auto body I've worked with a few companies in the past so I went to the companies I trusted. My husband and I drive Acuras and Hondas. I went to the dealerships, the Acura dealerships that I like and that we've dealt with in the past and I spoke with the guys and said, "Who would you refer?"

Adeola Amole:
They gave me some auto body shops. Then I went to the Honda dealerships, "Who would you refer?" I had a list of a bunch of them. Go to the source. If you're looking for even if it's just furniture and stuff go to the sources. Go to the people you know who have fabulous furniture or go to the companies themselves and just start talking to the people who are working there. Sometimes they'll tell you, "Don't buy it here. Go here."

Bobbi Rebell:
Is there an advantage to talking to them in real life versus just calling around or looking at an app?

Adeola Amole:
You know, I think there is. Always that human connection will get you the better referrals and then you can connect with them, right? So they're willing to give you that information. Absolutely.

Bobbi Rebell:
I think being in person makes a huge difference. Tell us more about where we can find out more about you and your book.

Adeola Amole:
Oh, absolutely. My book 7 Steps To Get Out of Debt and Build Wealth, guys, it's available everywhere. Go to my website www dot Adeola Amole dot com and there you can choose your retailer of choice because I'm on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Books A Million, Indigo, pretty much anywhere you can buy books it's available.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love it. Thank you so much. Social media, where can we follow you?

Adeola Amole:
Instagram is my stomping ground. I'm everywhere but Instagram is my stomping ground. I'm at Adeola Amole B.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you so much. This was great.

Adeola Amole:
Aww. Thanks for having me, Bobbi. I appreciate it.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, friends. Let's get right to it. Financial grownup tip number one, when it comes to things like cutting your debt no ask is too aggressive when you negotiate for interest rate reductions like Adeola. She went for the 0% interest rate. Kind of surprised me but I'm impressed. While she didn't always get there she sometimes did so why not ask?

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two, listen to the whispers at work. Pay attention to the larger macro economic climate and what's going on in your industry. Adeola in her gut knew that there was a good chance she was going to get laid off but she was still surprised. Financially, though, with her multiple and largely passive income streams she was ready.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right, everyone. Adeola has generously sent, from Canada no less, two signed copies of her book 7 Steps To Get Out of Debt and Build Wealth to give away. All you have to do is DM me your takeaway from this episode on any of the social channels. On Instagram at Bobbi Rebell 1, on Twitter at Bobbi Rebell, or if you prefer email you can email me at Hello at Financial Grownup dot com. Big thanks to Adeola Amole for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media Production.

Reality TV can be a job- but it often doesn’t pay like one. To film The Bachelorette and later Bachelor in Paradise Derek Peth had to take a break from his paying job in commercial banking. That’s where his emergency fund savings became the star of the show. 

Derek's money story:

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm so glad that you're here and so many of your fans are going to be tuning are going to be blown away by what they learn about you, because you're so well known as one of the ... first of all you were on The Bachelor on the JoJo season.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You did not apparently live happily ever after with her. But you went on to more success on Bachelor in Paradise season four. And you even now continue a side hustle, which we'll talk about, host a podcast about Bachelor in Paradise and The Bachelor. But we're here because, and this got by the way this announcement of what you're doing now got over 16 thousand likes on Instagram. We're here to talk about what you do for a living right now, which is you are in the financial services sector. You are a Senior Vice President at Laurel Road. So congratulations on this career path as well.

Derek Peth:
Thank you. This is the original career path. Speaking of side hustle, I think that's kind of what The Bachelor became for me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly.

Derek Peth:
Hey, more opportunities.

Bobbi Rebell:
Absolutely. And you're stilling doing that. We're going to circle back to that, but I want to talk about your money story because what you're going to share with us is something that is, on the one hand unique to you and the people that are on reality TV shows, but also very relatable to almost anyone that has ever dreamed of taking a break from their quote, real career, their everyday job. And asking our boss for a sabbatical so that they can do something, maybe a dream, maybe an opportunity for an interesting experience. Maybe financial opportunity down the road. But that's what happened to you. You were working, all of how many years ago? Four years ago maybe?

Derek Peth:
Yeah I think it was about four-ish years ago. I was working in commercial banking as a sales role down in Florida at the time. And actually it's a funny story how it all originally happened because I wasn't ready for it. I didn't signup or anything, I was very focused on my career, and I thought it was a prank call from a radio station at first. I made them email me, and I researched them.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait. How did they find you? I just assumed people apply to be on these shows. You just get this call.

Derek Peth:
I know. My sister signed me up.

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
I didn't figure it out until three weeks later when finally I ... because I had been kind of quiet about it and then finally I was like, "Hey did you happen to sign me up for The Bachelor ever?" And boom. There we go.

Bobbi Rebell:
She didn't tell you? Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
No. Her friends watch the show and it was like they all got around the computer and sent my photos and information in. But when I started thinking about this, it was like this is one of those opportunities that are once in a lifetime that can change the course of your life completely. And luckily, my mom has put self-help books in front of me my whole life, and I've been very, always interested in making sure that things were setup so that ... I ran some marketing businesses on the side when I was younger. I had a nice foundation of rental income incoming constantly that put me in a situation where I was like, "You know what? I don't necessarily need to have this job." While I enjoy what I'm doing, and I have a great relationship with my boss at the time. He really tried and he was like, "Listen, you're a sales role."

Bobbi Rebell:
Well what happened? Can you go in and say, "Hey I'm going to be on a reality TV show can I have a sabbatical of I don't know how long?" How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Exactly. I called him up. I said, "Hey I really need to have a side conversation that needs to be pretty quiet because there's some legal matters." And he was freaked out so he called me right away. But the legal matter was that I couldn't really discuss what the situation was with a bunch of people. And I just said, "I don't know. It could be one week that I'm gone, it could be eight weeks, 10 weeks." That's how long they tape for, and you have no idea going in. He went back and he reached out to HR and they tried to figure something out, but in the end, the response was basically, "This is a little too much of an ask right now, Derek. The only option is, if you want to do this you have to leave and quit, or you can keep working here. And call us back afterwards." The truth is, there's no chance on us just putting and eight week paused on your role.

Derek Peth:
Like you said, I saw it as a sabbatical of sorts, because there was that open end coming back, which I built from working by butt off in my job. And I built that foundation that I could really use to support my living without a normal income by working my butt off on the side. And again, I think there's a lesson there that really gives you the opportunity to do some unique and different things sometimes in life that we all dream and talk about, but when you're forcing yourself into the bare minimums, that's where I think, like I said, luckily I've had some of that literature in front of me my whole life and it was just pounded in my head, "Make sure you have enough income to live for a full year with what you're doing."

Bobbi Rebell:
You had a full year of income saved?

Derek Peth:
I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
How do people support themselves on these shows? Do you get paid to be on, do you get paid more if you last longer on the show? How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Some of those work that way. The actual Bachelor, Bachelorette, the first one there's no income from it, but the second show that I did that you talked about, it works that way where it's a per day payment situation. And so, it depends on what show you're talking about. Obviously, as we both know, the Instagram ad game has become I think the goal for a lot of people after that. And that's where the supporting themselves, and being a public figure offers some cool opportunities to do some travel where, if you're going and doing speaking somewhere or just doing an event anywhere, a lot of times there's free travel or the event itself, I should say, takes care of the travel and the accommodations. It is a unique situation. It's a little bit different than having to jump on Spirit because you're flying all over the place.

Bobbi Rebell:
But people going on these shows are not necessarily paid. There are costs involved, and you often lose your income. I don't know that people really understand that.

Derek Peth:
Yes. And that's why a lot of the people end up on the show, I think, are entrepreneurs. When you really think about it, there's business people and some small business owners a lot of the time, and it's because they have the flexibility to do that, they don't have this fear of having to jump of a cliff with their job, because it's scary thing. Not to mention just the nature of the United States these days. I don't know the exact numbers, but the cost of college has quadrupled or more in the last few years, and when you really look at that and compare that to what you come away with, and what you need, we have to have that income in order to just survive, right? Just the environment itself has made it so hard for people to jump out and do anything unique like this without cutting away, and living at home, and dodging their student loans.

Derek’s money lesson:

I think that rule is so important for people to live by. Instead of focusing on how do I get to the next paycheck, you got to focus on a rule, a separate goal. And that maybe 5% of their income for some people, 10% of their income. That's a conversation, especially if there's relationships, there's other situations that come in, but instead of maxing out what you're making, there needs to be savings goal and then a long-term goal of course. One of my favorite sayings is, how do you eat the elephant? One bite at a time. You have your big goal, but then one little step at a time, each month, each week, you're saving that money away, and that's how you, I think, create that foundation to give you the opportunity to go and do some different things.

Bobbi Rebell:
And also because as much as these kinds of ventures can create opportunity, at the end of the day, you're not an actor.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You have a normal life to some degree. It will never be quite as normal again, and you're still doing a lot of Bachelor related things, but you have an actual job.

Derek Peth:
There's a few very successful individuals. No different than professional sports. Honestly every aspect of business and any job in and of itself has high performers, and medium as well. But a lot of people in that quote, medium performance, which of course relates to how many Instagram followers you have now. But they really butt their head up against the wall and get sucked into this life with these hopes and aspirations without the understanding that it does take the work no different than your job to do some hustling, to make connections, to call people, to set things up for yourself. They do the bare minimum, and sometimes that's nice for a little while, but I mean, I think the people who have been very successful with taking this opportunity that The Bachelor presents you with and have treated it like a job. You see some of those folks who previously had jobs.

Derek Peth:
I have a great example from my season. Wells, great example. They were high performers in what they were doing already. And they pivoted everything into, all right, this is my new side gig. I can just take the same lesson I learned from working hard and taking care of business in my day-to-day life and apply it to this new opportunity.

Derek's everyday money tip:

My money tip, especially for millennials like myself is, first and foremost, within the marketplace we're in, there's an urgency to refinance your student loans. We ourselves we save over $20 thousand, on average, for people who refinance their loans, when you look at the life of their loans. I think knowing your rate in the first place is a great place to start. A lot of people, a lot of my friends even when I started working at Laurel Road they didn't even know what their rate was. And I started talking to them about the opportunities and they were just mind-blown at how much they could save each year.

I don't mean that facetiously. They were shooting, kicking themselves saying, "Hey, I'm an idiot. I haven't been looking at this. I didn't even know that. Here I am complaining about my income, and I could have saved it just by going online, doing a little bit of research." And to all those millennials out there, or anyone else who's recently gone through school and still has those student loans, go refinance them. There's no cost. It's very quick. I'm going to say, go check out Laurel Road's website because we are, I think, the best at this, but across the board, that's the number one thing we need to be doing.

Financial grownup tip number one:

Emergency funds aren't just for when bad things happen. In this case, a really amazing thing happened, a once in a lifetime opportunity. Literally life-changing experiences, and Derek had the financial resources available to cover up to a year. So when he was on The Bachelorette, not a lot of financial stress. And then even more fun on Bachelor in Paradise. And by the way, did I mention he hosts The Bachelor podcast, which is strangely addicting, even though I don't even know all the people that Derek, and Kay his co-host, are talking about. Don't be judgey. Derek has had a great ride. And I'm not saying that I know anything, or that Derek told me any upcoming projects, maybe when we kept talking after we stopped taping. But you want to stay tuned to what Derek is up to. Follow him on all the socials, and keep tabs on him at Laurel Road.

Financial grownup tip number two:

I joked with Derek about being judgey. We can all get judgey, myself included, about productivity, and joke that if we spend all day watching Netflix, or whatever, on Instagram, on our social media channels, we're not going to be building our businesses, our personal brand empires or whatever our goals are. So yes, we have to be mindful of our time. Go listen to the Laura Vanderkam episode for tips on that, by the way. But you know what, I really enjoyed Derek and his cohost on The Bachelor podcast. And the Bachelor shows are really fund. If that's your thing, enjoy it. Like all indulgences, chocolate, try to keep it under control. Maybe do a Bachelor in Paradise marathon over the holidays with your friends, get it out of your system for a little bit, then be more productive in the new year. Enjoy it. Don't feel bad. It's all good. And then of course, come back and listen to all the good advice here on Financial Grownup to get your finances in order for the new year.

Episode Links:

• Derek’s website - Laurel Road

• The Betchelor podcast

• The Bachelor

• The Bachelorette
  

Follow Derek!

• Instagram

• Linked In

• Twitter

• Facebook

Want to learn more about productivity? Click Here to listen to our episode with "Off the Clock" Author @LauraVanderkam

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Soon after Christine Armstrong’s husband took a company buyout and launched a family vacation business, the executive and new mother found herself in an intolerable job situation and quit to start her own business- resulting in a double dose the challenges of startup life. 

In Christine's money story you will learn:

• Being miserable in your job isn't worth the money

• Why Christine and her husband went from having two good paying jobs to not having any set income to rely on and how they made it work

• By being curious how other parents were balancing work life and home life, she started interviewing them, which led to the inspiration of her book - The Mother Of All Jobs

In Christine’s money lesson you will learn:

• How little you can spend when you really put your mind to it

• Be conscious of how much you are spending on childcare and figure out a way to best balance that expense with your work life

In Christine's everyday money tip you will learn:

• How to be more eco-friendly with your gifting over the holidays, and save money

• How to teach your children the benefits of gifting second hand goods and why they should be proud of it and not hide it

• Where to find the best high quality second hand goods for yourself, and for gifting

In My Take you will learn:

• Don’t spend the time stressing about the money. It is gone. Move on psychologically and just do better next time

• Keep your fixed costs low

Episode Links

Check out Christine's website - www.christinearmstrong.com
Link to buy Christine's book on Amazon - Mother Of All Jobs
Link to Ebay.com

Follow Christine!

• Linked In

• Twitter

• YouTube

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Christine:
What we were astonished by, having gone in a really short space of time from two corporate incomes to nothing, was how much spending you could just strip out overnight. We just cleared everything. We cut television packages, gym memberships, old insurance policies. We just scaled everything right back.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of How To Be a Financial Grownup. You know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay, we're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey friends, have you ever heard the acronym DINKS? D-I-N-K-S. Double income, no kids, usually used in the context of couples that have a capital F for fabulous lifestyle. How about if that was now double startup, two kids. That is where Christine Armstrong, author of The Mother of All Jobs, and her husband found themselves, and let me tell you, there was drama with a capital D. Spoiler alert though, they survived, but they lived to tell the tale and we get to benefit.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone, if you are new, so glad you found us. If you have a sec, do a screenshot and post it on social media, make sure you tag me so I can welcome you personally to our Financial Grownup community. The show stays around fifteen minutes because you're busy, but feel free to binge listen to a few if you have a little more time. We now have a library of more than 100 amazing high achievers sharing their stories and lessons.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, let's get right to it. Here is Christine Armstrong. Hey Christine Armstrong, you're a financial grownup, welcome to the podcast.

Christine:
Thanks so much.

Bobbi Rebell:
And congratulations on you're new in the US book. It's already been a huge hit in the UK where you are called, The Mother of All Jobs. How to have children and a career and stay sane-ish. Emphases on the ish, right?

Christine:
Yeah, totally.

Bobbi Rebell:
You have managed to stay sane in an extraordinary circumstance where both you and your husband found yourself in startup mode. Tell us your money story.

Christine:
So I had a lovely job at an advertising agency and I traveled all over the world and presented work. When I had a baby, I came back to the ad agency, but the boss had changed and they were offering me different terms and I kind of panicked and I took another job, which wasn't a great fit for me. It was a really heavy [inaudible 00:02:56] culture and I was really kinda stressed. It wasn't a great place for me anyway, but it particularly wasn't a great place with a small baby.

Christine:
But I felt I couldn't leave because while I had been on maternity leave, my husband, who'd been eighteen years at his company, was offered a big package to leave and he was like "Look, I really wanna take it, I wanna startup this business." I was like "Okay, yeah. That'll be fine, great idea."

Bobbi Rebell:
Because you would have the steady income.

Christine:
Right, 'cause I was just gonna go back to my job. It never occurred to me that I would want to stop or do less work. That kind of career was what I did. My job at the ad agency, they were really senior women who had families, and that seemed to be what they had done and it was fine.

Christine:
So we found ourselves in a situation where I was really unhappy at work and he was with the startup, which is a travel company called [inaudible 00:03:40] as you know with a startup, you don't make money immediately, so he wasn't making money, but we still needed quite a lot of childcare, because also, he wasn't home being just a parent and I was working really hard, but quite frustrated. So, I kind of was looking for answers in what I thought I could do to kinda make things better. I decided that I would have another baby.

Bobbi Rebell:
Of course.

Christine:
Of course.

Bobbi Rebell:
Because that will solve everything.

Christine:
In my mind ... you know, they say when you are really stressed, you start making really bad decisions and you can only see things in black and white. I was just like, I got to get out of here and I've got to take time to think, so I had another baby, which was great, but it obviously didn't solve my problems at work. Then I went back to work and it was still really, really difficult. So I decided to go and interview women about how they made it work, and some men as well. That was really where the book came about.

Christine:
During this process of interviewing these amazing people and understanding what I needed to do, I had lunch with a really old friend who's a therapist. We were in this café and I just talked at her for 45 minutes. She looked at me and she said "Look darling, just go. Go back to the office, get your coat and go home." I said "You're insane. I've got a mortgage, I've got childcare, [inaudible 00:04:58] is making no money." She's like "Yeah, but it'll be fine, just give it to the universe." I'm laughing at the word-

Bobbi Rebell:
The universe does not pay your bills.

Christine:
No, no. So, I didn't take her advice. I didn't literally go back to the office and resign, but I went home that evening, I said to my husband "Jill says I should resign" and he says "Yeah, I think you should, you're so unhappy, it'll be fine." So I did and then ... in the UK, you get three months notice. So I had three months of pay, so I kind of had three months to sort things out. During that period, we booked an amazing trip of a lifetime to go visit my sister in Thailand.

Christine:
Basically, the first thing I did with no income whatsoever was get on a plane to Thailand and go stay in five star hotels, but my sister had booked me where breakfast costs like $50 a person. Chris and I just kind of got fits of hysterical giggles and weren't really sure what to do or how to make it stop, because it was all pre-planned. Chris was like "Okay, the only thing we can do is just to enjoy it and then we'll deal with stuff when we get back."

Bobbi Rebell:
So basically, so now, you're gonna start your own business as an author, because you've got this book in progress. Your husband is at this business, which spoiler alert, is doing great now, but was at its early stages and you're living a lifestyle that needs two incomes from steady jobs to support.

Christine:
Well, I would say that that was our saving grace actually. I think we were really fortunate that my husband bought a house a long time ago, so actually, when we came back from Thailand and were like "Okay, let's just clear the decks. We've gotta lose every piece of spending that we have that is not essential." What we were astonished by, having gone in a really short space of time, from two corporate incomes to nothing, was how much spending you could just strip out overnight. We just cleared everything. We cut television packages, gym memberships, old insurance policies. We just scaled everything right back. What we were astounded by, we really worked together on it, we were really focused on it. We went from shopping in the equivalent of Whole Foods to the discount aisle at the discount supermarket.

Christine:
We were just astonished actually how little you could spend when you really, really put your minds to it. Having been massively complacent, it has to be sad. So, we just stripped out all spending and twiddled everything back and basically rebuilt from there. So I didn't immediately start a business. I freelanced for a while and then I met a guy called Robert Phillips who had it in his mind an idea of a consultancy he wanted to set up and was really inspirational.

Christine:
I joined up with a group of people and we started a consultancy that's been really successful and it's given us a great and stable income and allowed us to compensate. But it really took nearly a year for us to sort all of that out.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, what is the takeaway for our listeners?

Christine:
So my takeaway, the thing that Chris and I have taken a run through our lives is to keep your fixed cost as low as you can, so that you've always got the flexibility to [inaudible 00:07:55]. We were saved by the fact that we didn't have an expensive car policy, we didn't have kids who have expensive childcare, we don't have kids in expensive schools now. We keep the baseline really low so that we can scale up or down according to what we've got available.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what you learned really, is that a lot of these expenses that were just part of your life, you weren't really thinking about. It was pretty easy to just say goodbye to them.

Christine:
It really was. I do totally take responsibility for having previously been compulsive, but we both had good jobs, we both got promoted pretty regularly, our incomes have got bigger and we just really assumed that they would just continue to get bigger. We just really were very thoughtless about A, the impact of childcare and how much money that is. And B, how you often also lose one or half a salary and we managed to lose two salaries, which I think was quite an achievement when you have kids.

Christine:
I think my other big learning is ... as well as keeping your expenses as low as they can be in terms of core expenses, but also to be really thoughtful about what your childcare costs are gonna be and how you can organize work when you've got kids.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes. Another big expense with children is the holiday season and all this gift giving that goes on, which brings us to your everyday money tip.

Christine:
Yeah, I'm really interested in the circular economy which is reusing things and not keeping ... making new stuff. I really try and use second buy, second hand things, whether it's books, toys, looking on Ebay for things and getting the kids used to the idea that a gift is a gift, even if it's secondhand. I think that you can still give things to people they really care about, without spending as much money as you might have done.

Bobbi Rebell:
And not hiding the fact that it is secondhand, actually making that part of the conversation.

Christine:
Yeah, absolutely. I think being proud of it, you know, mixing something up. My husband's great at re-painting stuff or making it look better and being really proud of it and saying "I found this in a secondhand shop and I thought you'd really like it" that's okay.

Christine:
What I find is that strangely, people are quite excited that you went through the trouble to go look for it for them and if you fixed it up and made it look nice, than great. Embrace it, enjoy it.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well one thing that I enjoyed was your book which is called The Mother of All Jobs. How to have children and a career and stay sane-ish. And as I joked at the beginning, emphasis on the ish. One of the great things about it, is that it's very real. You have some very relatable and specific stories. You did a lot of work interviewing people here.

Christine:
I did. I started off with those interviews I mentioned with really senior women who were very high fly. Then, I kind of went for the book to lots of really, really ordinary women, doing ordinary jobs who are never gonna be Chief Exec. Probably never gonna be on the board and just working to pay their bills, basically. To really understand the dynamics of their relationship, their kids, schools and just try to figure out how it all works together and how their solving problems and what works and what doesn't.

Christine:
There are no quick fixes, right? You look at each [inaudible 00:10:55], you go "What can I take from that that's useful? What's relevant to me right now?" That's the way it's set up.

Bobbi Rebell:
And the book has said it really smartly, in that it is bite-sized. You could read the whole thing, of course, but you could read it little by little and there are sections, breakout sections that are titled "If you are too tired and read the above" which kind of gives us the executive summary, because you're realistic about how busy parents schedules are.

Christine:
That's good also, 'cause I've got fifteen books on my bedside table and I wish some of them had a [crosstalk 00:11:26] section I could read as well. So yeah, it was a reflection of the experience and I read two pages in the evening after putting all the kids to bed and everything, then I fall asleep and I don't read anything else.

Christine:
Yeah, it was so that if people are skipping through it, they could just pick out some bits and come back to something later.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well you are wonderful, as is your book. Tell us more about how listeners can find out more about you, the book and of course, following you on social media.

Christine:
So, I'm a Twitter person, and that's C ARMSTRTONG LD which stands for London and I have a website at ChristineArmstrong.com and I look forward to hearing from your listeners.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thanks Christine.

Christine:
Perfect.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay friends. First, have you ever heard of something called the sunken cost theory? Financial grownup tip number one, sometimes, you pay for something and then, you can't get out of it. You are stuck and the money is gone. Like Christine and her husband's big luxury trip to Thailand. Don't spend your time stressing about the money, 'cause it's already bye-bye. It's gone. Move on psychologically, do better next time, but most of all, enjoy what you spent the money on.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two, keep those fixed costs low. Part of the reason that the panic attacks were kept in check for the couple was that they had a stable place to live. They own their home and they kept their overhead low because of that, so that they didn't have to worry about all of these bills that they were stuck with, that they couldn't do anything about. They were able to make changes in the high cost that they did have because, they were discretionary. Sure, you can go back and say they shouldn't, coulda, woulda, whatever, but ... the reality is, that when the you know what hit the fan, they were able to make some choices that didn't even seem that tough at the time. It's interesting that they never really went back to a lot of those discretionary expenses, even when they could, in theory afford them again, because their perspective had changed.

Bobbi Rebell:
You can go back now, of course and look at what you have that's discretionary and cut back, probably a good idea for most of us. But at least go and do an analysis of what you have that is fixed that you could not get rid of in this kind of unexpected situation where you suddenly have no income and two kids and businesses with bright futures, but still not any real, meaningful cashflow temporarily. Think about what you would do if you were in their situation.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, I hope this episode with the great Christine Armstrong gave you guys some perspective on your money and your life. Let me know your takeaways and if maybe your making some changes because of what you heard from Christine. On Instagram, I am @BobbiRebell1 on Twitter @BobbiRebell and big thank yous for leaving reviews, it helps others discover the show, as does just simply telling a friend. Thank you so much, you have no idea. Thank you so much to those of you who do all these things and who subscribe and spread the word. It is truly so appreciated. We put so much work into this show and your feedback is priceless. Of course, also priceless, is the advice we got from Christine Armstrong that helped us all get one step closer to being Financial Grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media Production.

The College Investor’s Robert Farrington loved his job at Target. He was also well paid. But he loved his family more. So he made the tough decision to leave and focus full-time on the side hustle that was already throwing off even more income. 

In Robert’s money story you will learn:

-The value of time and how Robert made the decision to leave a job he loved in order to spend more time with him family

-How Robert grew his side hustle from no income into his full-time business

-Advice on how to leave a job on great terms

In Robert’s money lesson you will learn:

-His take on the benefits of growing a side hustle

-The specific obstacles Robert prepared for before taking the lead in his business

In Robert’s every day money tip you will learn:

-The truth behind retail shopping myths

-Quick tips on saving money while grocery shopping

-The number one Black Friday tip

Bobbi and Robert also talk about:

-Where the idea for his website started

-His regrets about leaving his job

-The College Investor and the resources offered online

-The College Investor 6 minute audio show on Apple Music

In My Take you will learn

-How to be honest with employers about having a side hustle - while not oversharing

-How spending time with family during the holidays can be more valuable than rushing out for Black Friday Deals

 

EPISODE LINKS:

Follow Robert!!

Instagram @thecollegeinvestor

Youtube @TheCollegeInvestor

Linkedin Robert Farrington

Listen to The College Investor Podcast https://apple.co/2CqMuC3 

Learn more on The College Investor website https://thecollegeinvestor.com/ 

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Robert Farrington:
Am I really able to say that I value the time I spend with my family and stuff when I'm missing Thanksgiving and Christmas and holidays and weekends and not able to go to birthday parties?

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup. With me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. You know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Financial Grownup friends, get ready for an episode not really about money, but about living a rich life with your family. It's about the price of your time and the value of your time, and for many of us, not all time is created equal. Target store manager, Robert Farrington, had the money, but he wanted the time. Not just any time. Nights, weekends, and holidays, specifically, the times that most of us get to be with our families, but in retail, not so much. Fortunately, he had something else going on. More on that in a sec.

Bobbi Rebell:
First, a quick welcome to our new listeners and to our returning ones. If you like the show, take a screen grab, share it on social. Then subscribe so you don't miss any upcoming episodes, and make sure that you have it set in the settings for automatic download. With that, let us get to Robert Farrington's story. He now runs a little site. It's actually a really big deal website called The College Investor. And for you early stage entrepreneurs, it was a side hustle with literally zero income. Yes, zero income, no money coming in for the first two years, but that was a while back. He'll tell you more about it.

Bobbi Rebell:
Now, it is his full-time business and it is growing. You're going to love this story. Here is, the College Investor. It's Robert Farrington.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Robert Farrington. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Robert Farrington:
Hey. Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
You are ... And this is trademarked, my friends. You are America's student loan debt expert. You're also the founder and editor of The College Investor, so you have a lot of knowledge to share with us.

Robert Farrington:
Whew. You kind of scare me when you say it all, but yeah. I'm excited to share with you.

Bobbi Rebell:
So give us a quick summary of what The College Investor is and then we're going to move into your money story.

Robert Farrington:
Sounds great. So, The College Investor was started by me as a side hustle in college, because I wanted to share my thoughts on how to invest. But everybody that I knew was like, "That's cool Robert, but I have student loans and other things and I just can't get there yet."

Robert Farrington:
So over the last few years, we've kind of incorporated more about getting out of student loan debt, getting out of debt in general, and how to build wealth so you can start investing even in your early 20s, or in college, so that you can build wealth and set those financial footprints in motion for your future.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, this is where it gets really cool and exciting, because you've been working on this for a very long time. You are married. You have two young children, the oldest one going into kindergarten. You were full time at Target until a year ago and this was your side hustle. And then you were able to make the decision to flip the switch and take your side hustle full time. And that's your money story. Tell us more Robert.

Robert Farrington:
Yeah. So about three years ago, I started earning more than my Target job. You know, we were just stashing the money away and didn't really have any plans to leave because you have to understand, I have loved working at Target. It was a great company to work for. I had been there a long time. I was comfortable there. I was probably one of the top performers in my area, so life was really good at Target. But there is one big drawback about working in retail and that is that you have to work nights and weekends, and holidays.

Bobbi Rebell:
Even if you were the manager by then. You were pretty senior.

Robert Farrington:
Right, but I also believe in being a leader, so I would still work my weekends with my team. I would work a night a week with my team and then as the leader, I definitely had to be there on Black Friday and throughout the holiday season. It meant having Thanksgiving lunch at like 12:00 and then going to work at 2:00 in the afternoon on Thanksgiving day, so that we're ready to go when the store opens.

Robert Farrington:
That really became hard as my kids were getting older.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay, so tell me about the conversation that you had with your wife when this decision was made.

Robert Farrington:
It really was a series of decisions. First off, it was like, this is a cool side hustle. Let's not change anything. And then it was like, wow this is really becoming more of a thing and we can live off this business income on the side. And you don't need to work there. Finally, I really had to think about what we valued as a family. So my wife and I were talking and you hear these things like, "Show me your money and show me your time, and it will tell you what you value." So, am I really able to say that I value the time I spend with my family and stuff, when I'm missing Thanksgiving and Christmas and holidays and weekends, and not able to go to birthday parties.

Robert Farrington:
So, it was really really hard to leave something I was so comfortable with, but at the same time I also wasn't living my truth in that I wasn't necessarily doing exactly what I valued. And we could afford it. I could afford the life I wanted to, and said that I wanted to. And that really was a big part of our conversation with my wife.

Robert Farrington:
The second thing is, is contingency plans. We always had these conversations. I run an online business, so it's like, what happens if the internet goes out tomorrow? Right? Are we going to be financially okay if suddenly there is no income stream. So, it really was about planning and making sure we had enough saved and if the internet did stop tomorrow and I left my day job, would we be okay financially? And we kind of checked all these boxes and once those were all yeses, it was setting a timeline up for when does it make the most sense to leave?

Bobbi Rebell:
They knew about the side hustle right?

Robert Farrington:
It was one of those things. I never hid it, but I was never fully overt about it. It had been on my LinkedIn profile for a decade. My peers, every now and then, I'd get student loan questions from my peers. They'd be like, "I'm trying to pay off my student loans. Can you help me?"

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, but did the Target management know that this was producing more income than they were paying you?

Robert Farrington:
I never shared that, so I'm 99% sure that they had no idea. In fact, I know most of them didn't because when I left and afterwards, they had a little going away party for me and like, "We wish you the best of luck. We hope this all works well for you."

Bobbi Rebell:
So they had no idea?

Robert Farrington:
Yeah, and I never hid that. So that's the interesting thing. If no one asked, I was very candid. I've been candid even for the last seven, eight years online. On different podcasts and interviews and stuff, so it's out there.

Bobbi Rebell:
Did they ever think maybe we should pay him more? If he can make more from a blog, maybe we're underpaying him? Was there any kind of conversation like that, ever?

Robert Farrington:
It's hard, because I was extremely well paid. It was a nice six-figure ... I don't think people realize what you make at Target, but I was, with my bonuses and stuff, I was probably making about $180,000/year when I left.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wow. So, let's go back to quitting. So, how did you actually quit?

Robert Farrington:
So, I really did think about this and planned it out. Because I also, like I said, I wanted to leave on really good terms. I didn't want to burn any bridges, so I actually, my wife and I finalized our plans for leaving in February, or March of last year. We said we're going to leave in September. And I thought this was very respectful from the workload that was going on at Target, but it was also enough time that they could have enough leeway to have everything in place before the holiday season.

Robert Farrington:
I decided that we're going to give a month notice, so I actually told my boss in August. And I probably gave about five and a half, six weeks notice. But I was fully ... You hear these horror stories like, if they were going to walk me out that day or something crazy, I was fully prepared to leave that day. But I was going to be very respectful, and so when my boss came in August, I would say she comes like once or twice a month. When she came in, I just pulled her into my office and said, "I have something really important to share with you." She had no idea what was coming. I said, "Hey. So I have some big changes I want to tell you. I am going to be resigning and I'm going to be pursuing my own endeavors outside of Target. Spending more time with my family."

Robert Farrington:
And the look of shock, she actually texted me like four hours later. So I told her at probably 4:00 in the afternoon, so this was like 8:00 at night. She's like, "I cannot believe this. This is crazy. I'm totally shocked." I totally caught her off guard. But I gave them, like I said, almost six weeks notice. So, I felt like I left in the most respectful and terms possible. Which I also think is the best way to possibly leave if you are going to leave.

Bobbi Rebell:
What was the reaction around your store?

Robert Farrington:
Most of them were pretty excited for me. I think all my direct reports actually were much more aware of everything then anybody else above me. And so, it was less of a shock, but same thing. I'm also very diligent in how you let people know, so make sure you have a very strong hierarchy of letting my senior managers know. And then just announcing it downward. Clear communication before I even let them know. So, I don't think I let them know until about a week and a half after I let my boss know. So my boss already had some plans in place, and we were able to share some very specific plans, which I think is really important when you transition in any workplace.

Bobbi Rebell:
Are there things you would do differently, looking back?

Robert Farrington:
I honestly would probably do it sooner. It's one of those things, I was so worried about all these random variables. And I probably gave an extra year or two to Target. And like I said, it's a great company but at the same time, what could I have done in those extra year or two when I could have left longer. That's the only real regret I have.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is the lesson for our listeners?

Robert Farrington:
I think the big lesson is, if you grow this side hustle with your time and energy outside of work instead of watching TV shows, or doing whatever non-productive things you're probably doing outside of work, you could turn this into a full-time job that you're passionate about, you love, and it works with your schedule. So, I think it's definitely a clear path that you can actually achieve if you want to put the time and effort into it.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, let's talk about your everyday money tip. We're going to tap into your knowledge as a retail expert, having seen it all, from the grassroots level. Tell us what people can do to save money and be better shoppers at stores, not necessarily just Target, but stores like Target. What can they know about pricing, about sales, and so on?

Robert Farrington:
Yeah. Let's debunk some of these myths first. So first off, I always love these Buzzfeed articles that come out. What digits are the last ones that you know what the markdowns are?

Robert Farrington:
Well, let's talk a little bit about math. So almost every price in retail ends in 99 cents, right? So, when you mark something down half off, it's always going to end in eight. Because that's just math. And so when you mark it down 75% off, for the third time, or the second markdown, it's going to end in a four. So, these math strategies that they say are secret hacks, is really just the math of the sales. It's true.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah.

Robert Farrington:
I think people just need to realize that. I think the best thing ... The other thing that people need to realize is that, almost every store Target included, puts the same things on sale every two weeks. So it just alternates, so if you're a regular grocery shopper, you'll notice this a lot. Especially in food, because one week it'll be Coke on sale, the next week it'll be Pepsi on sale. And then it goes back to Coke on sale. Then it goes back to Pepsi on sale. And it's the same sale. It's just goes alternating every other week. And you see this in almost every major retailer, so one, if you have really strong brand allegiance, align your shopping habits with your sale week and you'll probably find that you're going to get that same sale every time you go in because it will line up with your shopping habits.

Bobbi Rebell:
So you said you always have to work, you've always had to work the holidays and especially Black Friday. What's your number one Black Friday tip?

Robert Farrington:
The number one Black Friday tip is that all the ads come online about a month before Black Friday. So you can plan out all your shopping ahead of time. And you have to realize that the door busters at every store, there's only about 10 to maybe 50 of that item. And so, if there's one thing that you really really really really can't live without, if you're not the first 10 to 50 people in line, you're probably not going to get it. So don't waste your time going out there.

Robert Farrington:
The second thing though, that's really emerged over the last couple years is online shopping. So at the same time, a lot of these companies are trying to compete with each other and they're moving their Black Friday sales online and they're moving them on to the week before Black Friday. So you can get a lot of the same great deals online, but without even going to the store, about a week before you even shop.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's talk more about what's going on with The College Investor. So this is your full-time passion project, slash income, slash growing company. You've got a whole staff there now. You're managing that now. What are you priorities? Where is your growth going to come from? What can people expect and look forward to there?

Robert Farrington:
So if you want to know anything about getting out of student loan debt, and starting to invest, The College Investor has it for you. We have pretty much every topic around student loan debt covered and you know, sadly as much as I don't want this to be the growing reason for our growth, student loan debt in America is growing and it's such a problem for most people. So we have your answers. We have tools and resources that can help you. If you don't like to read, you can also listen to The College Investor audio show. It's a podcast where we change our written articles into a short digestible audio show for you because I know-

Bobbi Rebell:
You love that. Love short.

Robert Farrington:
Yeah.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes. I love that.

Robert Farrington:
Short. I mean, I think I beat you because my average show time is like six to eight minutes because we're just talking about the daily article of the day.

Bobbi Rebell:
But that's perfect. That's what people need because everyone's busy. Alright, where can people ... People can obviously reach you at The College Investor, but tell me your social channels et cetera.

Robert Farrington:
Yeah. You can go to thecollegeinvestor.com. You can go to The College Investor audio show. You can find us on YouTube at The College Investor and you can find us on Instagram at The College Investor.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love it. Thank you Robert.

Robert Farrington:
Thank you for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
By the way, that pricing math that Robert thinks is so obvious to everyone, I had no clue. What about you?

Bobbi Rebell:
Here's my take on what he had to say. Financial Grownup tip number one. If you have a side hustle, follow Robert's path and be open about it at work. You don't have to be too open. When I went to write my book, How to be a Financial Grownup, the first thing I did was tell my managers and get their okay. Don't hide things. But then also, don't work on it during your work hours and you can be open about your plans, but you don't have to share the whole big picture and all your grand plans.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two. I love that Robert chose family over spending time working on the holidays. The same can be said for shopping. Before you race out to get one of those amazing, say Black Friday deals, remember that Robert said, and a lot of you know this already, there are very few available. So, you'll have to get here really early and spend a lot of time, invest a lot of time, to get it. So is saving money really worth cutting into your family time on a holiday? Maybe look online, a different day, ahead of time and set a price alert. Then, if you get that alert, you can spend five minutes buying it online and get back to being with your family. Or, maybe what you have is fine and you don't buy it at all.

Bobbi Rebell:
Before we wrap up, tell me, I want to know, what's your best retail shopping tip? DM it to me. And please, take a minute to follow me on social media. I am @bobbirebell1 on Instagram. bobbirebell on Twitter, and Bobbi Rebell on Facebook. The website to get more information about the show, bobbirebell.com/financialgrownuppodcast and for the show notes and more about Robert and the The College Investor, go to bobbirebell.com/podcast/robertfarrington and thanks to The College Investor's Robert Farrington for bringing us all one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK media production.

Performance coach Jen Cohen is a master at ab crunches— crunching numbers. She shares the story of how she talked her way into a job at Olive Garden before she was even old enough to work- and then reveals her secrets to eating healthier on a tight budget. 

Jennifer’s Money Story:

Thanks, Bobbi. When you asked that question, it makes you think and go back into your brain a little bit to think why someone is the way they are, subconsciously. I think it really goes back to when I was really small, four, five years old when my mom and dad did get divorced, and I guess money was quite tight. I do remember my mom, to make extra money, my mom is a psychiatric nurse, and she had a full-time job, but she had now two kids also, and it wasn't enough, so she would have these odd jobs.

Jen Cohen:
I don't remember all the details, but I do remember her working to sell stuff. She sold Mary Kay cosmetics on the side. She would also cut out pieces of the carpet in our apartment where she was selling them, and I think that vision or that imagery really stuck in my brain in a negative way. It told me right at that moment, "I don't want to be poor, or I always want to make my own money and feel financially stable and secure, not to rely on somebody else for my financial security."

Jen Cohen:
From that moment, I guess even as a small, small child, I went through life thinking of ways of having side hustles or working and doing things. When I was 12 years old, I remember bargaining and hustling with the manager of the Olive Garden down my street about working for him.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait, you were 12 years old, and you were working at Olive Garden?

Jen Cohen:
I was. I was a greeter. They wouldn't allow me at 12 because you're too young to get ... I wasn't allowed in the actual restaurant because it was illegal, but I negotiated my way with this guy and just begged him and just hawked him enough where he gave me a job as a greeter. I was able to open up the front door for customers when they walk in. When they first get there, the first person you see was me, and I'm like, "Hello, welcome to Olive Garden." That was really my first real legit job when I was in nine, no, seventh, eighth grade, something really ... I was young, where I remember people in my neighborhood be like coming to the restaurant and be like, "What are you doing here?" It was very odd.

Bobbi Rebell:
But it sounds like you were actually really proud to be earning money, even at that young age. You weren't embarrassed about it. You were excited.

Jen Cohen:
Oh, God. No. I loved it. I always loved having my own money. I always loved having that option, never having to ask my mom or whoever. If I wanted something, I would have it, but here's a caveat. I would never spend my money, so all of this was for me to have savings. It wasn't for me to actually buy stuff. I've never been a very materialistic person. It's really about having in my head knowing that I had that backup, having that security blanket. I would literally save everything.

Jen Cohen:
Then through high school, through college, I always had multiple jobs just so I had it where very comfortable later on, but it was never about that. I've been very rich, and I've been poor, or in the middle, but it's never been that story that's driven me. It's really about that I think one experience when I was a little girl that just has always been subconsciously in my brain where I'm driven to make and create financial security just to have it.

Jennifer’s Money Lesson:

The takeaway is, A, number one, always spend below your means, not above, just so you have that ability, and find and figure out ways to save money. There's so many ways now. You can eat cheaply. You can figure out ways. You can work out for free. You can eat for less than $7 a day. There's a lot of ways to be crafty and resourceful if you want to be.

Jennifer’s Money Tip:

People can actually be much healthier on a very restricted budget. First of all, eating canned salmon. Canned salmon is automatically wild.

Bobbi Rebell:
I didn't know that.

Jen Cohen:
Yeah.

Bobbi Rebell:
And wild salmon is better. That's not just a myth to charge you more at the store.

Jen Cohen:
Absolutely not. Farmed salmon has a lot of toxins and maybe a lot of mercury. It could have a lot of different things in it. That's why people say limit your fish intake to maybe once a week, twice at max.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, and that wild salmon is really expensive near me.

Jen Cohen:
It's expensive everywhere, but if you buy canned salmon, just make sure you look on the can. If it says wild Alaskan, that can of salmon would be maybe $2.50 to $3 at most, and that's higher quality than salmon that you would buy that would normally cost about $14 a pound anywhere else, maybe $17 a pound, depending on where you live. That is the perfect portion. That in itself is a meal.

Bobbi Rebell:
How do you usually eat it? Do you put it on a salad? What do you do with it usually?

Jen Cohen:
You could do anything. You could put it on a salad. You could actually ... When I'm starving and I need something to satiate me, I could just take the can of salmon, mash it a little bit of Vegenaise or mayonnaise whatever you'd like, or just put it in a bowl or whatever, eat out of the can as a snack. When I was on a budget I would eat that all the time, and I still eat that.

Jen Cohen:
The other thing is frozen vegetables. Frozen vegetables are a higher quality-sourced produce than what you find at the store because by the time it's at the store, it's been sitting on trucks, it's already half rotten. When you buy frozen vegetables, they flash-freeze them when it's at its peak, so the quality is better.

Bobbi Rebell:
So frozen vegetables, but not canned vegetables? What's the difference there?

Jen Cohen:
Listen. Canned corn, there's nothing wrong with canned corn. I mean, the reality is this: I don't like canned vegetables as much because I think when you do that in the cans, they have to add sodium. I try to stay away from that, but when it's the frozen vegetables, it's typically just the vegetable in itself flash-freeze in a bag so there's no added anything. It's just the vegetables. Canned vegetables typically have to have a preservative to keep it because it's not frozen, and also added salt. That's why I choose to have the frozen vegetables.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love that all.

Jen Cohen:
And frozen fruit, by the way, too.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes, and I do that in smoothies a lot, actually. I did that even today in a smoothie.

Bobbi’s Financial grownup tips:

Financial grownup tip number one:

Don't be a food snob. Jen talked about eating frozen veggies and canned fish and how, quote, "fresh" isn't always better even if it's organic. Oh, my goodness. Could you imagine? Organic not being the absolute best? You need to pay attention. You can really get burned paying up for all that so-called fresh food because when you take away all those chemicals, which you should, we don't want the chemicals on our food, of course, but sometimes, the shelf life is just really short.

Recently, I splurged on these organic grapes at Whole Foods, and they went bad so fast. I had paid $8 for a bunch because I really wanted the grapes and I wanted to feel like I was eating healthy, and they barely lasted. That is also, by the way, a reason not to go shopping with your kids because I was with my son, and he also felt we should get the grapes, even though they were really expensive, and it's really hard to say no to a kid with they ask for food that's actually not junk food. Even if it's not the absolute healthiest fruit, it's not junk food, and that hard not to encourage, so try to leave your kids at home when you shop, although that's not always realistic.

Financial grownup tip number two:

The power of persuasion is very real. Good for Jen. Jen really shouldn't have been working at the Olive Garden at age 12 because it was not actually fully legal, but she got her way because she was creative and she found a way to get to yes with a reluctant manager and find a way to work there without technically working there and not technically breaking the law. That was a great lesson for all of us, Jen. Be persuasive and find a way around obstacles.

Episode Links:

• Blinkist - The app I’m loving right now. Please use our link to support the show and get a free trial.

• Jennifer’s website - jennifercohen.com

• How to save money and cut calories on your morning coffee from Starbucks

• Jen's book Badass Body Goals

Follow Jennifer!

• Instagram - @TheRealJenCohen

• Twitter - @TheRealJenCohen

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Performance coach Jen Cohen is a master at ab crunches— crunching numbers. She shares the story of how she talked her way into a job at Olive Garden before she was even old enough to work- and then reveals her secrets to eating healthier on a tight budget. #EatHealthy #EatHealthyOnABudget #Author

At 29 years old Tanya Van Court thought she had more than a million dollars on hand to change the world and live the life of her dreams. Until it vanished in a few hours. 

Tanya's money story:

Tanya Van Court:
I was 29 years old, it was in the first tech boom where all of the Silicon Valley companies had stock that was just rising uncontrollably. I happened to be one of the first 200 employees at a company in Silicon Valley that was doing extraordinarily well.

Bobbi Rebell:
What company?

Tanya Van Court:
The company was Covac Communications. Before any of the telephone companies or cable companies were offering high-speed data I had a great job, a meaningful job, and I had a lot of stock that went along with that job.

Tanya Van Court:
I got all this stock in Covac, and some of the stock I couldn't cash out yet, but a lot of the stock I could cash out. I could have sold that stock and went and diversified my portfolio and bought mutual funds, or invested it in many, many stocks, as opposed to having all of my eggs sitting in one proverbial basket. But I didn't, because it was literally the first stock I had ever known or owned-

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait, let's just back it up, so you were given, as part of your compensation, shares in this company. Did it go public? Where was this stock? Explain exactly what you were given, and how it was valued, and did you have opportunities to sell it?

Tanya Van Court:
Yes, I had opportunities to sell the stock, many opportunities. The company had gone public, and so I had the opportunity to sell the stock when the company went public, I had the opportunity ... not exactly when it went public, because we had a certain window. But that window had passed, and so I had many opportunities to sell the stock, but I had no idea that I should sell the stock.

Tanya Van Court:
The stock kept going up, and I thought, "Wow, this is great. The stock just doubled in the past six months. I should just hold onto it, and I guess it will double again."

Bobbi Rebell:
At its peak what was the value of this stock, and how old were you at that time?

Tanya Van Court:
I was 29, and the value of the stock at its peak was about 1.2 million dollars.

Bobbi Rebell:
At that time how did you feel?

Tanya Van Court:
You know, I was so excited, because since I came from a household of two parents who were elementary school educators, all I ever wanted to do was make a difference in the world. I knew that having that 1.2 million dollars in my late 20s was going to enable me to make different choices and different life decisions to help people and to give back instead of just working in corporate America and doing things that were kind of interesting to me, but weren't impactful to other people. I felt free, Bobbi. I felt really free and empowered.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're 29 years old, you have stock that on paper is worth 1.2 million dollars. What happened then?

Tanya Van Court:
The big Dotcom bust happened. Literally in hours stock just started to tank for company, after company, after company. I watched the stock literally go from being in the teens, each share was trading in the teens, to trading for less than a dollar. When I say less than a dollar it went from the teens to like .50 cents in the course of a few hours. Every bit of that 1.2 million was wiped away in a matter of hours.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wow!

Tanya Van Court:
Yeah.

Bobbi Rebell:
How did you feel then?

Tanya Van Court:
Then I felt stupid, I felt deflated, I felt panicked, depressed, it was almost as if you had 1.2 million dollars sitting in your living room, and you just left the front door to your house open and walked out and went to the park, right?

Tanya Van Court:
It was, like, wait a minute. I had been living this life and treating this money so casually, as if it would always be there.

Bobbi Rebell:
As you say, it was the dotcom bust. This was happening to everyone?

Tanya Van Court:
It was happening to everyone, and it's interesting, because while I suffered a tremendous loss with that stock that I could've diversified, what I still had was ... I still had a home that I owned, I had bought a condo, and I still had that. What I found with many of my colleagues who experienced that same bust, is that they had actually leveraged their stock to buy lots of other things, so they bought cars, and they bought multiple houses.

Tanya Van Court:
Because they had borrowed against that stock, once the crash happened, they then had to pay back the money that they had borrowed by going and selling off all of their assets, including the assets that they had come to the company with.

Tanya Van Court:
If they came to the company with a big million-dollar home in Silicon Valley that was passed down to them from their parent, or that they had worked really hard in a previous company to be able to buy, now all of a sudden, they not only lost all of their stock, they lost every other asset that they had, because they had to payback loans that they had made against their stock.

Tanya’s money lesson:

Oh my gosh. Diversify, diversify, diversify. Don't ever put all of your money into one basket. I don't care if that basket is a real estate basket, and you have found a hot, booming real estate market that's working really well for you, and so you're, like, "Let me just buy it."

More apartments here in X place, or more houses in X place, don't do that. Diversify your money. If you have found that your golden goose is a stock that is doing really well, don't do that. Diversify your money. You really have to weigh and measure your risk, and think about the worst case scenarios. If that particular company, if something happens to that company, if something happens to that area of town that you're investing in, and every asset you have goes under water, what happens to your entire portfolio?

Tanya's everyday money tip:

My everyday money tip is actually a money tip that kind of goes back to my time in college. I would always watch people who ... I don't happen to drink, but I would watch people who would do progressives. Where they went from one bar to another, or one restaurant to another, and progressively partied from one place to the next. Like, the party would follow them. Like, a group of people would go and they'd hang out in one place, and they'd do that for 20 minutes, and then they'd go and hang out at another place.

I thought, "Wouldn't that be fun if we did that just with our friends, and did it in order to swap and exchange stuff that we no longer needed at our respective homes." Look, we all look in our homes and we go, "There are 10 things here that I don't use anymore, that I don't need." If you happen to have kids there may be things that your kids don't use anymore, or your kids don't need. If you happen to be a sports fan there may be equipment that you don't use anymore. "Hey, I'm not golfing as much as I used to anymore."

There are things in all of our homes that we don't want or we don't need, and so it's a great way of getting together with five or six friends, scheduling it on a Saturday, and going to each other's houses where you put everything that you don't want in your living room, and it becomes a virtual shopping spree.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love, first of all, that it's social, and I love, also, it's always delicate, because when you want to gift to somebody something that maybe you don't need anymore it's an awkward thing to give them something that you don't want. Because it's kind of like, "Oh, you're giving me your leftovers." But if you just put it there and they can just decide to take it, then it takes away that sort of negativity and makes it a positive thing.

Tanya Van Court:
It absolutely does. I think it makes it a positive thing for everyone, like, you're super happy to get rid of it, but they're super happy to get it.

Financial Grownup tip #1:

One things Tanya mentioned that stood out is that, while she lost money that she had on paper, I know it still hurts a lot, others had leveraged against their stockings and lost so much more. In addition to her advice to diversify, we also want to be very careful when borrowing against actual assets. Do not over leverage.

Financial Grownup tip #2:

This holiday season take it a step further than what Tanya was talking about. Think carefully about the physical stuff that you are buying for other people, not just children. Unwanted gifts are a total waste of money. There are so many new ways that technology is allowing us to give differently. Apps like Goalsetter are great, especially for kids that have too much stuff. But when you want to send a physical gift, and sometimes this is even for business purposes, there are new services, like, GiftNow. That's my personal new favorite that I'm obsessed with.

Basically, the way that one works is that instead of a boring gift certificate you virtually send someone a specific gift from a retailer to their email, so you don't need their physical address, you don't have to send them an email asking where should I send this, who will receive it, blah, blah, blah. It opens in a virtual gift box, and they can select their size, so you don't have to be guessing. They can change the color, if you don't know what color they want. They can even exchange it all before it gets delivered, so you don't have the whole hassle of the return and all that stuff.

I just used it for my friends' baby's one year birthday. It was so great to not have to carry a gift to the party, not worrying about it getting lost in the pile, and to know that my friend could swap it out without me even knowing it, not worrying if she would hurt my feelings, if she didn't love the fabulous dress that I got her daughter.

Then again, you can never have too many little frilly little girl dresses, right? I'm sure it was a huge hit.

EPISODE LINKS

Check out Tanya's company GoalSetter here!

Tanya Van Court is on Shark Tank!

Follow Tanya!

Instagram: @tvancourt

Linked In: @Tanya Van Court

Twitter: @tvancourt

Follow Goalsetter!

Instagram: @goalsetterco

Twitter: @goalsetterco

Facebook: @goalsetterco

Learn more about GiftNow

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Guest co-host and shopping expert Trae Bodge joins Bobbi with her three rules that practically guarantee you will avoid amateur spending mistakes this holiday season.

As a child, the future founder of McPherson Strategies learned about money when it was used as an incentive to break a bad habit. Susan McPherson also shares an extremely important money tip about ways to give to charity beyond your means as we get towards the holiday season.

In Susan’s money story you will learn:

-How money motivated Susan to stop a bad habit as a child

-What 4-year old Susan did with her earnings

In Susan’s money lesson you will learn:

-How even seemingly small amounts of money can serve as an incentive to change behaviour

-The importance of using creative tools to teach kids about the value of earning their own money 

In Susan’s everyday money tip you will learn:

-How to get paid by your company to volunteer 

-The importance of making sure you tap into your company’s matching dollar program when you give to charity

Bobbi and Susan also talk about:

-Susan being on of Twitter 25 smartest women

-Her company, social impact corporate responsibility consultancy McPherson Strategies turning 5 years old!

In My Take you will learn:

-The importance of making sure your co-workers are also aware of company gift matching programs

-How you can leverage organizing a team for a corporate charity event into a networking opportunity as well

Episode Links

Learn more about Susan’s company McPherson Strategies!

Follow Susan!

Twitter: @Susanmcp1

Instagram: @Susanmcp1

Susan mentions Microsoft as an example of a company with a generous gift matching program. 

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Susan McPherson:
My mom offered to pay a penny for every time I blew my nose. So enterprising Susan at age four blew her nose 347 times.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup, but you know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson and then my faith on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Money is a powerful motivator for us aspiring financial grownups and apparently, as we will learn from our guest, for four-year-olds. It's never too soon to get on board. It doesn't always have to be starting a business, aka a lemonade stand, to teach kids about money as we will learn from our guest, the remarkable Susan McPherson of McPherson Strategies which provides social impact consulting.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome, everyone. Thank you for your reviews and support. I read every one and they mean so much. For those of you who are new, we keep the episodes short, about 15 minutes because you're busy, but we know a lot of you binge listen when you have a long commute or are running errands. The idea is to create flex time for our podcast and speaking of busy. Our guest, Susan McPherson, is a moving target traveling the globe, helping her clients ... Well, make the world a better place through her company, McPherson Strategies. If you are ever fortunate enough to be anywhere near where she is speaking in person, you need to go make the time. Susan is such a dynamo and there's a reason that she was named one of the 25 smartest women on Twitter, so you need to be following this woman on Twitter too.

Bobbi Rebell:
Susan is the consummate connector and I am so honored to call her a friend and she shares a fantastic story. Get ready. Here is Susan McPherson.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Susan McPherson. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Susan McPherson:
Well, I am so excited to be here Bobbi. You know I'm a big fan.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you and I have been working to get on your calendar for quite some time. I know you just got back from a big trip and you are celebrating five years for McPherson Strategies. Congratulations.

Susan McPherson:
Thank you. My accidental company.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well, we'll talk more about that in a minute, but for folks who don't know you, they must check you out on social media where, for example, you were named, by Fast Company, one of the 25 smartest women on Twitter. You actually have won a bunch of these Twitter accolades and by the way, for good reason, because your tweets are absolutely brilliant and profound, but also brilliant and profound is little Susan as a four-year-old because that's how old you were when this money story happened and I can't believe this. This is the most original and we've done more than 100 shows. I am going to go out there and say this. This is the most original money story we've ever had on Financial Grownup. Susan McPherson, tell us.

Susan McPherson:
Well, I'm thrilled that it could meet those expectations. But when I was a young child, I had a terrible issue of getting ear infections all the time because when I would have colds, instead of blowing my nose to clear my airwaves, I would sniffle back in. I just didn't like the thought of putting the tissue up to my nose.

Bobbi Rebell:
What was that about? Why?

Susan McPherson:
And it was gooey.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay. All right.

Susan McPherson:
And I think out of frustration, but also out of having to drive me to the doctor's office for all those ear infection treatments, my mom decided to be how can I use this as a lesson for my daughter and offered to pay me a penny one Sunday for every time I blew my nose. So enterprising Susan at age four blew her nose 347 times.

Bobbi Rebell:
In one day.

Susan McPherson:
In one day and of course, I looked like Rudolph by the evening with a very bright red nose, but I succeed in the mission of no longer sniffling in.

Bobbi Rebell:
What'd you do with your proceeds, Susan?

Susan McPherson:
Well, I remember my piggy bank couldn't hold that many and my dad helped me rack the pennies so that I could then turn them in to get actual bills and I think we just sucked it away. Just spend lots of money at Kindergarten because that's where I was headed next, so maybe crayons.

Bobbi Rebell:
The start of your investing career.

Susan McPherson:
Exactly. Exactly.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is the lesson from that aside from blow your nose, even if you're not being paid.

Susan McPherson:
Oh my God, don't get ear infections maybe. No, I think it's learn to count. Learn the value.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes because you did learn ... I have to say, as a four-year-old, counting to 347. That actually is a big number.

Susan McPherson:
Yes. Well, when you're the youngest, you tend to pick up things like that very very quickly.

Bobbi Rebell:
But seriously, what do you think are the money lessons that people can take away from that, especially money is a big motivator obviously for you. You didn't want to blow your nose, but you wanted those pennies.

Susan McPherson:
I did. I think it's working to make money. Nothing falls off trees, right? We all have to work hard and we have to be perseverate and obviously, my parents were creative or at least my mother was creative to get me to think about how I could use something that I was either wasn't good at or could be good at. Now granted, blowing your nose is not something you would do for a living, but take it for what it is. So for those of you, moms or dads, who are listening, maybe you have a child who has a similar issue and this may be a way to motivate them. Although I have a feeling you might have to offer quarters or dimes for every nose blow rather than pennies.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes, a little less of inflation over the years. On a more practical basis for the adults listening, you do have a great everyday money tip that almost anyone that works for a company probably can do or can do something about getting their company to make it available.

Susan McPherson:
Thank you. Thank you. Yes, such a great question and I have to say for those of you who work for corporations or business, you should always ask if there is an opportunity for paid leave to go volunteer for the causes you believe in and you also should find out if your company provides matching dollars, which will make any donation you give to a particular cause have greater impact and to give you an example, not all of us work for Microsoft, but Microsoft matches up to $15,000 that you donate to an accredited nonprofit organization. That means if you give $15,000, that nonprofit will get another 15, which is $30,000 in your name.

Bobbi Rebell:
Whoa. That's nice.

Susan McPherson:
Yes.

Bobbi Rebell:
And that's lost money if you don't simply file the paperwork.

Susan McPherson:
Exactly. Exactly and it's super super easy. So if you have not inquired at your company, by all means, inquire about both. Many many companies now are offering a day or several days that you can take to go volunteer at an organization, so I would not miss that opportunity.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you, Susan. So let's talk just for a couple of minutes about McPherson Strategies. As I mentioned, it is five years old and you jokingly call your accidental company, but it's far from that at this point. You have been quite strategic in it and the company is growing. Tell us more about what the company does and how people can learn more about it and maybe get involved.

Susan McPherson:
Aw. Thank you so much, Bobbi. I really appreciate that. We are a social impact corporate responsibility communications consultancy. Meaning we help companies, nonprofits, social enterprises, and foundations use communications to provide visibility to the good work that they are doing and that can be a whole plethora of things. But most important, it is helping these folks provide visibility to the social impact they are having on today's society. We operate out of New York, but we have an office in Chicago and an office on the West Coast in Portland, Oregon and I think you can find us online at mcpstratgies.com and of course, on Twitter, you can follow me @susanmcp1 and if you just have an interest in either working with us or hiring us, just let me know. I'm easy to find.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you, Susan. This was amazing.

Susan McPherson:
Oh. Thank you, Bobbi. You're a gem and thank you for all you do.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey everyone. Love that story from Susan and I have this great image in my head of little four-year-old Susan blowing her heart out to earn that money. That kind of determination has served her well in life and I really loved what Susan had to say about leveraging your companies matching program to get every dollar possible for the causes that you care about. Here are more things that you can do.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number one. Spread the word. If you make a donation to charity and your company matches it, maybe just mention it to your coworkers as in, "Wow. I love that our company has a donation match." Don't assume everyone already knows that or that they know how to do it. They might be intimidated by the paperwork, not know where to look and just not bother. Same thing with friends. I know people who have parties to celebrate, let's say, a birthday and then they ask that the gifts be donations to a charity. Well, if you do that or if you know of somebody doing that, make sure that it gets communicated however you're comfortable that everyone who's giving a donation should find out if their company is able to provide a corporate match. Talk about amplifying the impact that you can make. Never assume that other people are as well informed as you are or even as motivated. Like I said, they might have the idea that the company doesn't match, but feel like, "Oh. There's so much red tape. I don't want to do it." There's a lot of easy money left on the table simply because of people maybe not wanting to seem pushy, asking people to do this when it comes to donations or if people are just being lazy or feeling intimidated about the whole thing.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two. Susan mentioned taking days off to volunteer which is amazing if your company provides it. I would also add that you, yourself, can organize a team for a charity event for your company and ask your company to sponsor it. They often have this money allocated in the budget or can get it if you ask. They don't cost a lot. It's usually a minimal thing and here's the really great bonus part of it. It's that by being the organizer of a team for, say, a charity run. You're not only going to be raising money for a cause. You're also going to be the one organizing it, which means everyone is going to be coming to you when they have questions, when they need their race shirts, whatever they're going to be wearing, their numbers and this is a great opportunity for networking within the company and you can meet people at all levels of the company, both the top people that might get involve or even the lower level people and it's important to know people in different areas of your company as well, so it's a really fun thing, you're doing something good and your meeting lots of different people within your organization, so it's a winning strategy overall. Hope you guys try it. I should have done that when I was at a big company. Live and learn.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thanks to all of you for being part of the Financial Grownup community. We bring this to you for free. The only payment that we ask is that you share it with someone that you care about, that you believe would enjoy the podcast and get value from it. Your reviews and feedback mean the world to us. I read every one, so please take a few minutes to leave a review on Apple podcast, aka iTunes, or wherever you listen to the podcast and like I said, tell a friend to join us as well. And of course, thanks to Susan McPherson for getting us all one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Boreland Group Founder and CEO Jennefer Witter learned early on that the best way to get clients was to offer extreme value. But to stay in business, and continue to serve the clients, the author of the Little Book of Big PR also learned when to put the brakes on the discounts. 

In Jennefer’s money story you will learn:

-How to utilize a current network to create a new one

-Why Jennefer values transparency with her clients and how it helped her build a business

-Ways to find out what to charge new clients

In Jennefer’s money lesson you will learn:

-How to create meaningful relationships with new clients

-Three ways to look at the return on investment

-Why Jennefer always sets a definite stop date with her clients

In Jennefer's everyday money tip you will learn:

-The one question Jennefer asks that saves her small business big bucks

-Why it's good to be aggressive in business negotiations

In My Take you will learn:

-Take an angle that makes you eligible for discounts

-Why sometimes working for free has the biggest pay off

Bobbi and Jennefer also talk about:

-Jennefer mentioned that she gets a small business discount for ProfNet, which helps her public relations company get leads

EPISODE LINKS:

Jennefer's book is available online here

Check out The Boreland Group's website here

Follow Jennefer! 

Twitter: @JenneferTBG

Linked In: @Jennefer Witter

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Jennefer W.:
It was a six month program, and yes I invested, when you added up over $10,000, but what I got back through that $10,000, was multiples in return.

Bobbi Rebell:
You are listening to, Financial Grownup, with me, Certified Financial Planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of, How To Be a Financial Grownup, and you know what? Being a grown-up is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay. We're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story, from a financial grown-up, one lesson, and then, my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, financial grown-up friends. Every business, or pretty much every business, I would think, starts as a start-up, and every business has to get that very first sale, and that very first client, and to make it happen, in most cases, that first client, that first sale, the business owner has to be willing to lose money on the bet, that they will win over that first client, and build from there, but many businesses make a mistake, in that, they don't really set the expectations right, and then when they do have to raise the price, so that they can actually make money, they get backlash, because the client's expectations were not aligned with the realities of the business.

Bobbi Rebell:
Our guest, public relations whiz, Jennefer Witter, who is the head of, The Boreland Group, and by the way, literally, wrote the book on PR. It's called, The Little Book of Big PR, was careful in her approach at that delicate start-up stage, and it has served her well.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone. We have a lot of new listeners, that we are very excited about. The show's are short, about 15 minutes, because you're busy, but of course, you can binge, stack a few together. Maybe if you're commuting, have a little more time to listen. Consider it flextime for podcasts, and with that, let's get to our amazing guest. Here is Jennefer Witter.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Jennefer Witter. You are a financial grown-up. Welcome to the podcast.

Jennefer W.:
I am so thrilled to be on, Bobbi. How are you?

Bobbi Rebell:
Well, I'm excited to finally snag you. You are one busy lady. You are, the CEO and Founder of the boutique, Boreland Group, and you're also the author of a book that I loved reading, 'cause I'm kind of on the other side of it. It's The Little Book of Big PR, which is awesome, and it really is a little book.

Jennefer W.:
It's a tiny little book. It's a paperback, softcover. You can also get it as an e-book, and I wanted it to be little, because you know what it's like as an entrepreneur.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah.

Jennefer W.:
You have some things on your desk. You have to do this. You have to do that. You don't want to be reading, War and Peace.

Bobbi Rebell:
No.

Jennefer W.:
So, with the full book of Big PR, the full title is, The Little Book of Big PR: 100+ Quick Tips to Get Your Small Business Noticed, is you can read a chapter here, a chapter there, or you can read it all at once, and it will not take you more than a couple of hours to read it, and you walk away with information that you can readily use in your business practice.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love that, and you are an entrepreneur. Your business has grown, but when it first started, you had to make some difficult choices, and we always say, "Don't undervalue yourself. Don't give away services for free, but it's kind of complicated." Tell us your mini story.

Jennefer W.:
Well, here's the thing. When I first started The Boreland Group, it was 15 years ago. I really didn't think about becoming an entrepreneur. So, when I decided to do it, it was just like, "You know what? I don't have clients. I don't have any income coming in."

Jennefer W.:
So, I reached out to everybody that I knew, and I said, "Do you know of somebody, who is looking for a boutique public relations firm?" And I got one response back, after sending out like 200 emails, and it was a friend of mine, and he said, "I have a friend, who's sister-in-law is looking for a publicist." And when I met with her, she did not want to pay what I was charging at that time, and so, what I decided to do was invest, because I only was going to have one client, and I knew that once I got that one client, once I got that chance, I would have those doors open.

Jennefer W.:
So, what I did was, she paid me [crosstalk 00:04:20].

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait. Let me just stop you there. So, you say what you were charging, but the truth is, you were charging no one because you had no clients.

Jennefer W.:
No. No clients.

Bobbi Rebell:
This was your first client. Right. So, you had an idea of what you wanted to charge, but you didn't have a rate that you were getting. So, you needed to start building your client roster.

Jennefer W.:
Oh, absolutely, and so what I did with this one client was, and I'll give everything as transparent. I charged her $1,800.00 a month. One thousand, eight hundred dollars, and then, I invested another $1,800.00 into her. So, it normally would have been $3,600.00, but I was only getting back $1,800.00.

Jennefer W.:
Now, you may say, "You're giving away your services." And I absolutely was, but I knew that once people saw what I was doing, getting her into the media, getting her speaking opportunities, that I would be able to build upon this client that I had, into a client portfolio, and after [crosstalk 00:05:16].

Bobbi Rebell:
Was this client, Jennifer, let me ask you, was she aware? Did she really only have budget for $1,800.00, and was she aware that she was getting, quote, double the value of what you felt you should be paid?

Jennefer W.:
Oh, she was absolutely aware, and what I told her was, for this first six months, I would charge her $1,800.00, and at the end of the six months, it would go up to the $3,600.00. So, she was fully aware, and I wrote a program, and I said, "This is what you're going to get overall." And I said, "This part you're going to be paying for. This part is what I'm investing in." And I put together a plan, that was very tight, because you have to be careful about such things. You don't want to say, "I'm going to give you $1,800.00." And you wind up giving somebody $5,000.00. You definitely need to have parameters, that you don't sink yourself before you swim, and once I started to do that, and then I started leveraging, and I'd say, "I have this client. This is what we're doing."

Jennefer W.:
When I was meeting with the media, some of the media saw what I was doing, and they sent some direct clients over to her, and at the end of the six months, I did a new program for her at the full price, $3,600.00, and she knew that it was coming. She saw the work that I was doing. She appreciated everything that I was doing, and more than that, she saw the value. She signed the account. I got paid the $3,600.00. I had other clients, who were paying that amount, and my business was based on an investment, that I knew would pay off in the long run, and it did.

Bobbi Rebell:
And what is the takeaway for our listeners? Among young people, there's a lot of talk coming up in business, that it's really important to be aggressive with your pricing, and not undersell yourself.

Jennefer W.:
You know, I wasn't underselling myself, and you have to want to give, in order to get, and when you have zero clients, and you have the opportunity to get a client, who you know will be the foundation of growing your business, you need to take that step, and you need to invest, and know that at the end of that six months, or whatever timeframe you're going to get your money back. You have to look at the big picture. You have to be long term, and you have to look at that ROI, the return on investment. It can't stretch out forever in eternity.

Jennefer W.:
You need to have a definite stop date, which is exactly what I did with this client. It was a six month program, and yes I invested, when you added up over $10,000.00, but what I got back through that $10,000.00, was multiples in return.

Bobbi Rebell:
That is a great story. Let's talk about your every day money tip, because it also pertains to when you start a business, and you're the small guy, you still need to have the tools, that the big guys have, but they are expensive. So, you have a tip on how you can save, if you are an individual, or a small boutique business, and you have to be assertive about it. Go for it.

Jennefer W.:
Oh, absolutely, and what you need to do, this is what I did. I am a small business. I've always been a small business, and whenever you're going out for products and services, if it's expensive, you know you have to use it, but tell them, "You know what? I'm a small business. Do you have a small business discount? What can you give me? I'm not the Edelmanns, or the Ketchums of the world. I'm not pulling in like $30-$40 million a year. I'm pulling in a fraction, but what I am is a client, and there's more of me than there are of the Ketchums, and the Edelmanns, and the large corporations."

Jennefer W.:
So, if you go out there, and you are aggressive, if you are forceful, and you say, "Look, I'm a small business. I'll be a loyal client. Give me that discount, that I know that you can give me." Let me tell you, it works.

Bobbi Rebell:
Just so our listeners who aren't familiar, you were referencing large public relations firms, 'cause you are in the public relations business. So, can you give us a tangible example, of something that you bought when you were starting out, or buy now, and approximately what it would cost for a large business, and approximately what it would cost for a ... how much you can get a discount from, from sort of the list price, so people have an idea of how much you can ask for?

Jennefer W.:
Sure. One of the services that I use is called, ProfNet, and it's specific to the PR community. What it is, you get pushed about 100 leads a day, and you go through them seeing which ones are, that you can respond to. It's from reporters. It's from producers. They're looking for interview topics for the stories that they are writing or producing.

Jennefer W.:
For large companies, it's several thousand dollars a year. I'm not exactly sure. Like $3,000.00 or $4,000.00, and by making it clear, and asking for a discount, and saying that I am a small business, I got it for less than $1,000.00 a year. So, right there and then, I was able to save about, over $2,000.00, that I would have paid ordinarily, if I had not spoken up and say, "Hey, I'm a small business. I'm a solopreneur. What can you do for me?" And it worked, and I saved a lot of money, because of that.

Bobbi Rebell:
Where can we find you, and find out more about you?

Jennefer W.:
Well, you can always find me on Twitter, which is J-E-N-N-E-F-E-R-T-B-G. You can go to my website, which is The Boreland Group dot com. B-O-R-E-L-A-N-D Group dot com, and I'm on LinkedIn, and again, my first name is spelled funny. It's J-E-N-N-E-F-E-R, and the last name is W-I-T-T-E-R. No h.

Bobbi Rebell:
Is there a story behind the spelling of your name?

Jennefer W.:
You know what? I wish. I just think it was a nurse, who spelled it incorrectly. Both parents deny spelling it with the e, and it's on my birth certificate, so it got there some way.

Bobbi Rebell:
That's so funny. Okay. Love that, but it sets you apart. So, there you go. We're all unique in our own way. Thank you so much, Jennefer, with an e, Witter. This was amazing. Thank you.

Jennefer W.:
Thank you, Bobbi, with an I.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay, Friends. Alright, let's get right to it. Financial Grownup Tip Number One: Jennefer does a great job asking for discounts, because she is running a small business. That is the angle that she uses. So, think about what your angle is. There's countless ways for you to get a better price, or a better deal in some way, on just about anything, work or personal. You gotta find your angle.

Bobbi Rebell:
One of my favorite ways to get a discount on something that I need, for example, for my business, but don't want to pay the full price, or can't afford the full price. Maybe it's not in my budget. I say that. I just reach out and say to the vendor, "That's just not in my budget right now. Will you be in touch, if and when you have something that's an alternative to the offering, or maybe you can offer me a price reduction, an option that can work within my budget?"

Bobbi Rebell:
I have always gotten a response, and in almost every case, we've been able to work out a way for me to become a client, because ultimately, that's what they want. They want to get you in to their system, as a client, at some level, and then hopefully, later on down the road, they can increase how much you're spending, because you'll see the value in the product.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup Tip Number Two: So, here's the flip side of all that. The most important part of Jennefer's money story, isn't that she lowered the price for her client, or did some of the work for free, however you want to look at it. To get a new client, it's that she had a strategy to end it. Expectations were set right at the outset. So, let's just say, you're on the other side of the business that I just talked about, where you had a business owner like myself coming to you saying, "It's just not in my budget." And you work out a deal to get me onboard. The important thing is to set expectations to say, "Okay, we're gonna do this for one year, and then, in a year when you see the value and hopefully your business is doing better, and your budget would have increased, you're gonna come in at the regular price." And they're hoping, that I, the business owner, will see the value.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, it's important, as Jennefer did, to work with clients when they need you to work with them, but also have them recognize that they are getting something of value, that maybe they're not paying the full price for, and that the expectation is, down the road, the price will meet the level that it needs to be at, for the business owner to sustain their business, because at the end of the day, if you enjoy doing business with somebody, you like their product, you want them to stay in business, and to do so, you need to make a profit. All good things.

Bobbi Rebell:
Another great thing. If you enjoyed this podcast, let a friend know. Help us grow the show. Also, share it on social media. On Twitter, I am at Bobbi Rebell. On Instagram at Bobbi Rebell One, and DM me with your feedback. A lot of you have been doing that, and it's really great for me to hear which episodes really resonate, and what you want to hear more of, and maybe what you're not that into. That's okay too.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love hearing all of it, and as I have mentioned on previous episodes, we are now gearing up to do bonus episodes, which will include listener questions. So, send them in. You can DM me on the socials that I just mentioned, or you can email me them at, hello at Financial Grownup dot com. That's, hello at Financial Grownup dot com.

Bobbi Rebell:
I am such a fan of Jennefer's. She has so much to offer. Do check out her book, The Little Book of Big PR, and of course, The Boreland Group, and thank you, Jennefer, for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grown-ups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell, is edited and produced by, Steve Stewart, and is a BRK Media Production.

In Jerry’s money story you will learn:

-How Jerry learned the hard way that looking like you make money doesn't mean you do

-Three ways to deal with difficult people in the work places

-The benefits of having a career mentor

-Why Jerry sold all of his cars and his motorcycles and what it did for his budget

In Jerry’s money lesson you will learn:

-The simplest way to figure out financial assets and liabilities

-Jerry's two tips for figuring out where in the budget to cut down on spending

In Jerry’s everyday money tip you will learn:

-Where to buy luxury brands like Nike and Adidas for less

-The best athletic clothes that will last a long time

In My Take you will learn:

-Why it's important to keep an open mind and look past first impressions

-What T.J. Maxx, Marshalls, and other retailers have to offer when it comes to workout clothes

Bobbi and Jerry also talk about: 

-Check out the luxury athletic clothing brands we mentioned, Nike and Adidas.

EPISODE LINKS:

Order Jerry's book "Guns, Drugs, or Wealth" here

Follow Jerry!

Instagram: @realJerryFord

Twitter: @realJerryFord

Facebook: @realJerryFord

On this Financial Grownup podcast episode Jerry Ford helps us to learn how we can get the best deals on work out clothes. #Podcast #MoneyTips

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Jerry Ford:
I sold all of my cars, all of my motorcycles. I paid off my credit cards. I spend three hundred dollars a month on Uber pool and that's cheaper than any car note that you can get. And I set a seventy dollar budget for food per week.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grown-up, with me, Certified Financial Planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of “How to be a Financial Grown-up”, but you know what, being a grown up is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay, were gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grown up, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this!

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey financial grown up friends! Love this guest because Jerry Ford, who you'll hear from in just a few minutes, is just a little bit different from the typical guest that we have on here, in that he is not from a money expert background. In fact, he's a celebrity fitness guy, and he came to being a financial grown up really after he had money. And then he realized that he wasn't actually using all that money and there was a good amount of money. He wasn't using the money in a very grown up way, and some really scary things could have happened but fortunately he found a mentor that took him under his wing and set him straight before things went really down hill.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone. Thank you for investing your time in yourself and in learning from the high achievers that we have on the show. If you're enjoying it, remember the show is free. All we ask is that you help us grow the show by paying it forward and telling a friend that you think might enjoy the show.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's go to our guest. Jerry Ford is a celebrity fitness trainer turned author. He overcame intercity poverty, violence, personal tragedy, to get where he is today, which is pretty incredible when you hear his story. His book and this title kind of threw me off when I heard it and then when I understood what it was about I had to have him on the show. His book, "Guns, Drugs or Wealth" is riveting. Its very candid and I'll bet its unlike anything you've read before. And I want you guys to stay till then the end, we have a big give away. Jerry sent me three signed copies of his book. I'm gonna share details after the interview about how you can win them. Here is "Guns, Drugs or Wealth" author, celebrity fitness trainer, Jerry Ford.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Jerry Ford, you are a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Jerry Ford:
Hey, thanks for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Congratulations are in order. We are taping this before your book has even been released, by the time this is out, your book will be out. But, your book “Guns, Drugs or Wealth” the three income secret to success that took me from the streets of Detroit to the top of my game, is already a number one new release from Amazon and sure to have many more bestseller benchmarks in the weeks to come. So, congratulations.

Jerry Ford:
Thank you, I'm really excited.

Bobbi Rebell:
And were gonna talk more about the great information in the book, including different investing like real estate, stocks and the importance of earning and saving, after your money story, which is about, you're also a trainer I should say out there in L.A. where you are..

Jerry Ford:
Yes.

Bobbi Rebell:
It is about a client that you didn't start off great with, but ended up being a mentor. Maybe this is a little about not judging people on first impressions and being open to people that maybe are very different from you. Go for it.

Jerry Ford:
Yeah, you know what, that's true. So I was twenty-three years old. I was really young. I was working at a gym called The New York Health and Racket Club, and I was by far their superstar trainer. I was young. I had Rolexs, fancy cars. I thought I knew it all.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait, wait, wait. How are you buying this Jerry?

Jerry Ford:
You know what, I was top five in this company. This really luxury company called New York Health and Racket Club. And I was one of their top level trainers, I was training maybe two hundred and ten hours a month. Each session after you get bonus, after hitting a certain amount of hours that is unreal, I made maybe a hundred and ten dollars a session.

Bobbi Rebell:
And how many sessions a week?

Jerry Ford:
I was doing maybe two hundred and ten sessions a month.

Bobbi Rebell:
So they give you a new client and what happens?

Jerry Ford:
So now I'm thinking, you know, this client wants to work out six days a week. And he was calling two sessions, every session. So this guy was paying me double for every session.

Bobbi Rebell:
How old was he?

Jerry Ford:
This guy at the time was about fifty years old. This was maybe seven to ten years ago.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay

Jerry Ford:
And I said this is gonna be a breeze. This is nothing. All this guy wanted was abs. I said this is gonna be more luxury items for me, because at the time I thought that if you look like money that people would spend money on you, which is true but you can't take that too far. Right, so. So, I stared training this guy and little did I know he was the biggest jerk that I've ever met in my life. I mean, he would tell me to explain everything we were doing in two seconds and like snap his fingers and tell me to go as if he was timing me for my response. I mean I would drive to work in the morning time playing scenarios in my head, like literally cursing this old man out.

Jerry Ford:
And so six months later he tried to convince me that a chest press didn't work the chest. So, I kind of, you know, popped him on the shoulder and firmly explained, how a chest press worked your chest, you know. And he kind of stood there and shook his head and said, “Okay, fine.” But at that time, it was almost as if he was done testing me. You know from that day forward, we became best friends, mentor, kind of like a father/son relationship, it was strange. We talked every day about everything.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait. So, basically, he was waiting for you to push back.

Jerry Ford:
He was waiting for me to push back in a professional strong sense. Because we argue every day but he always enjoyed the fact that he got under my skin. So, he was testing me, waiting for me to push back in a certain way.

Bobbi Rebell:
And tell me what you learned from him.

Jerry Ford:
Everything. So before I moved to Los Angeles, he helped me build my portfolio. I mean to a “T”. He helped me gain a lot of passive income, and he taught me just everyday life lessons about being a businessman. So, when I moved to LA I was still the same, I started working at another gym, but I was training even more high end clients, I was training royal family members, celebrities, other taste makers. And then I got fired from Equinox. And when I got fired from Equinox I think that shook me out of being a superstar trainer for a corporation, for a gym.

Bobbi Rebell:
Why were you fired?

Jerry Ford:
I was fired for working out with one of my clients, which, when I first came to Equinox, Equinox was the gym, when I first came to Equinox because I had so many taste makers and so many celebrities and so many models back in New York I was able to work out with a lot of those people because, you know, models are at a certain level to where sometimes they don't want to you to train them and stand over them. They want you to work out with them. And in this case, a lot of my models, they were just a lot more when I worked out with them. I called Bill and I said, “Okay, very few people, make, one percent of the world make what you make. So, how did you do it?” And it was kind of silence over the phone and he was kinda like, “Oh, you gotta be good looking and the rest would flow.” It was like a joke, it was a joke, he's always joking. I'm like dude I'm not laughing, like how did you do it?

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, you're ready.

Jerry Ford:
I'm like ready to go and he's like, “You know what, when you gonna be in New York next? Well talk about it.” And I'm a all or nothing guy so I said, “Dude I'm hopping on the next plane to New York tonight.” So I went to LAX literally with nothing, I went to LAX, I hopped on a plane and went to New York on the red eye. The next morning, I went to Bill's house or his estate, he opened the door and literally I said, “Let's get to work. I need to figure out how you did this.” So he was like, “Oh cool your jets, and you know well talk about it.” So we ate some breakfast, we sat at the table, and he looked at me. And this guy, right now he's like a best friend but, he's your classical Wall Street fast talking, New York [inaudible 00:08:35].

Jerry Ford:
He says, "What's the difference between us?" I said, "No liability." And I'm thinking, man we've been over this so many times. And he's like "No, what's the difference?" And I explained how assets put money in your pocket and liabilities are obligations that they take money out of your pocket. And he says, "Exactly!" So then he did something that was life changing. He handed me a pen and a piece of paper and he said, "Okay. Write your assets down in one column and write your liabilities downs in another column." And literally I remember to this day, it was liabilities, rent, BMW payment, Porsche payment, motorcycle payment, insurance for all cars, AMEX credit card payment a month, Capital One credit card payment per month, phone bill, utilities, clubbing all weekends with royalty clients, shoes, watches, restaurants. It was terrible. And asset column was stock portfolio and personal training.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wow!

Jerry Ford:
And so he said, “I want you to reduce your liabilities and then come back to New York and we can get started.” So, I hopped on a plane back to LA. Bobbi, I sold all of my cars. I literally sold all of my cars, all of my motorcycles. I paid off my credits cards. I started to Uber pool, because I spend three dollars a month on Uber pool and that's cheaper than any car payment. I factor with car note and gas and occasional parking tickets, its cheaper than any car note that you can get. And I set a seventy dollar budget for food per week. After that I called Bill back, I said, "Okay, I sold everything. I'm ready to go". He thought I was nuts, but he could not deny that I was ready to build wealth. So he says, “Okay, are you gonna fly back.” I said, “No, due to the budget that I've set for myself, I'm calling you this time.”

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, so what is the lesson for our listeners?

Jerry Ford:
So, the lesson for the listeners is, I suggest that everybody write down their liabilities and their assets. And, just you seeing them in the columns, you would then be able to say, okay I don't need this, I don't need that, I don't nee this. And I advise people to buy more assets and less liabilities. But, you have to see it on paper.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright Jerry. What is your everyday money tip? Cause, you spend a lot of time in gym clothes. Is it really worth spending so much money on fancy gym clothes?

Jerry Ford:
Well you know what, you can go to some of these brands, so Nike and Adidas and all these luxury brands, places like Big Five have these same brands, but its just a lot cheaper. And, I wear gym clothes all day so I save a lot of money, right. And I wear gym clothes and then I throw on my luxury watch and luxury items and that makes me look a little more fancy.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, is it worth paying up for the more expensive work out clothes brands? I mean, obviously, if you're gonna buy them, you wanna buy them somewhere you can get a discount if that's possible. But, are they better?

Jerry Ford:
You know what, I think they are better, because I've taken Nike pants, Nike outfits, I've had them, and they've lasted longer than workout clothes from Target. You know, its kinda like, Oh you wash these clothes, and you wonder why they ripping up so much. It's because those luxury brands have better material.

Bobbi Rebell:
So they really are better.

Jerry Ford:
They really are better.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright, lets talk about your already bestselling book. Tell us more.

Jerry Ford:
So, this book is about building wealth through real estate, stocks and smart spending. But, I tell it as a personal trainer, but more importantly, I tell it in laments terms, as more of a porch casual conversation.

Jerry Ford:
Its kind of like if Jay-Z and Warren Buffet came out with a how-to guide on building wealth. "Guns, Drugs or Wealth" would be it.

Bobbi Rebell:
And its inspired by your actual life.

Jerry Ford:
It is inspired by my actual life. Its inspired by my actual life, which is coming from Detroit, the hard streets of Detroit, and starting to build wealth like I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
And where can people find you, find out more about you? You have a huge Instagram by the way. Love those videos. I'm ready to go workout right after this interview just from watching those videos. So, everybody, go put on your fancy expensive gym clothes, cause they're apparently worth it, and go work out.

Jerry Ford:
People can find my on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter. And my handles are @realJerryFord.

Bobbi Rebell:
Jerry Ford, thank you so much!

Jerry Ford:
Thank you!

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey everyone, lets get right into it. Financial grown up tip number one. Be careful about judging people by first impressions. Sometimes even second, third impressions. Jerry basically wrote off his client because, okay the client was such a jerk but, sometimes relationships, including those with mentors or sponsors, they take time to develop. Because the two men spend a lot of time together and Jerry was willing to start listening instead of just putting up with his client the relationship changed. And Jerry came out a big winner.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grown up tip number two. Let's talk about the fancy gym clothes cause this is something I actually spend way too much time even thinking about. I go back and forth on this. I want to say its worth it to buy the clothes that will last for a decade or whatever. But at the moment that you are actually trying to purchase leggings that cost over a hundred dollars, that's just really hard to do.

Bobbi Rebell:
I recently finally bought one really expensive item, its actually a Lululemon jacket, but only because I had an expiring credit. And I still fell guilty about buying it even though literally I had to use the credit and it was a gift. Here's a work around if you want the best stuff but can't always get over the price. So, for most work out items, the only difference between the new stuff or last season's is the color or the pattern. So this goes for sneakers too. So, look for last seasons of whatever workout gear you want. Stores like T.J.Maxx, Marshalls and then all of these departments stores has these outlet versions, you have like Nordstrom Rack, Sax off Fifth, whatever is near you and they probably also have a lot of this stuff online, those places are great places to look. Also, the quote "We made too many of the fancy boutique brands", they often have last year's style, last season's style, usually just a different color that wasn't as popular. Go work out feeling like a million bucks and maybe be like Jerry and wear a fancy accessory with your workout gear, so you can feel fancy like Jerry.

Bobbi Rebell:
Alright giveaway time. So, friends what was your takeaway from Jerry? DM me your thoughts on this episode on the socials, BobbiRebell1@instagram, BobbiRebell on Twitter. And I'm going to be giving away the three signed copies of Jerry Ford's book, "Guns, Drugs or Wealth" to listeners. And, yes it is open to international fans. In fact our last giveaway winners, which were the Chris Hogan and the Rachel Cruze signed books, included one listener Barbara Olner in Austria. And don't forget that we are starting to do listener Q&A episodes with some of my money expert friends maybe making guest appearances. So DM me your questions as well or you can also email us at hello@financialgrownup.com, that's hello@financialgrownup.com. And that goes for the giveaways to. So, DMs or emailing hello@financialgrownup.com whatever is good for you is good for us.

Bobbi Rebell:
And thank you to Jerry Ford. Great motivation to get us all one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownups with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.