Optometrist Jen Tsai was in the process of launching her solo practice when the pandemic hit. She shares how she kept her cool and managed to overcome financing and construction challenges, as well as build a retail practice while the world was in turmoil. 

Jennifer’s Money Story:

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Yeah, it definitely wasn't my goal to open a cold start practice in the start of pandemic. I honestly thought with the year being 2020 it would be good luck to open it with that, but you can never plan for things. I think that was an important lesson, to just always be prepared, especially financially, with working capital, when you go into any business. If we didn't do that, if I didn't do that, we would've been in a different place today.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
I think being prepared for that was always important, and being able to work the first couple of years, just seeing how other practices ran their business, really taught me a lot because I paid attention to their maybe downfalls and ways that they were efficient and applied that to my own business model.

Bobbi Rebell:
Now, how did you balance everything? Because you had these plans in place, you were geared up to start this business, then coronavirus hit and you did have other financial things going on you had to balance. You still had student debt, so you had to balance that. Did you take out loans? How did you finance this business and how did you keep going as this pandemic is emerging?

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Yeah, I definitely have student debt. Luckily, my undergrad was paid off and I had some scholarships. In terms of medical school and optometry school, it is quite expensive as we all know and we come out of it with a couple hundred thousand dollars with our name. I didn't always have a fear of taking out debt. I understood and I did my research about what the student rates were. I think a lot of people do have a fear of taking out student debt, and when they finish school their immediate goal is to completely pay off their loans because it may seem daunting or scary and they feel that they can't continue to do other things with their money.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, and it's not that it's bad to pay off the student debt. It's bad if it keeps you from living your life, I guess, is what you're getting at, that you don't start other things until you pay it down completely when you're facing, in your case, six-figure debt.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Yeah. I think that is definitely something that stalls people or holds them back. I think it's important to realize that student debt is not a bad thing. I think people see it as a bad thing. There's definitely a lot of debt that other people have that they don't realize on a day-to-day basis that's actually worse, which is credit card loans that you purchase stuff with. Those interest rates are definitely higher.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Going into that, I definitely saved up enough working capital and I made sure that I refinanced my loans to make sure that I had a lower interest rate. I didn't really let that stop me from chasing my dreams and going after what I really wanted. Initially, I was held a bit back, looking at the cost of how much to start a complete cold start. I was even looking at buying old practices that were definitely a lot cheaper, but also evaluating their P&Ls. Thinking about the whole thing, I realized in the long run, this is a short-term investment for your end goal, which is the more important thing. So I was willing to take that investment, especially on myself. That's what I wanted to focus on.

Bobbi Rebell:
How did things change when you were in the pandemic and you're trying to start this?

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Once it was around March, we were gearing up to open. We were finally putting down the finishing touches for the front of the store and then the pandemic happened. I'm in New York City, so when it first happened in March, it definitely was a tough time. It was really scary for us. We knew it was coming from upstate and then all of a sudden it became widespread and immediately everything just shut down. It was like a ghost town. We couldn't even go to the site to really look at the construction because we weren't even allowed to be in proximity with our contractors, so everything just came to a halt. I had to quickly convert to a virtual telehealth visit for my patients, while doing virtual Zoom calls with my architect team. It was just insane. It was an insane time. We couldn't even finish our construction because we had to apply for permitting in order to be able to finish construction during a pandemic.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Finally, around I would say maybe like June or July, they allowed us to go back in to finish construction. Of course, at that point there was delays in manufacturers with their materials, getting it to our store. It was just working around that. I mean, I will tell you, our store still isn't even completely done to this day. I've just learned to live day by day at this point. But luckily, we were able to at least open our doors August 6. I was just really excited to get in there. After four months of not really seeing patients in person, I wanted to be back in there to be able to care for the ones that really needed to see me during that time.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Then I was shocked because we basically, starting from the first day a month and a half ago to now, it's been seeing eight to 10 patients already. Partly, I think it would attribute to probably a little bit of social media, just sharing out there honest, brutal moments that I have and I think it makes it more authentic that people do see where you come from, and also sharing the fact that we're there to provide a space where they feel safe and comfortable, that it's modern and clean. I think that going forward, people really care about their health, patients really do, especially with COVID, that they realize how important their health is and they're willing to invest in that. I am grateful that people have been able to come in.

Bobbi Rebell:
What did you do in advance financially to shore up your finances and made sure you had that runway?

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
On a bigger scale level I think about it. People are either really trigger happy, or they're really risk adverse. If you're really risk adverse, you'll never take the first step because you're just afraid of all these self-doubts that you have. I think what has helped me is just really creating a strong financial plan and making sure that you have everything checked off for the worst-case scenario in case it happens, because you never know. I think for people who are trigger happy, I think that's one thing that they need to think about. Are there things that could happen, such as a pandemic, that will maybe cause me to not have any cashflow or working capital going into it?

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Coming out of school a couple of years later, I realized it doesn't make sense to not refinance my loan so that I could reduce my interest rate and have it all in one place. That has helped me manage my money better. I was working, I would say for the first four years, full-time. Actually, when I first started in two practices, then I went down to one. I hustled, I worked really hard to save money. I didn't put it all into paying off my loans. I used it to save up money, invest on the side, so I had a better cash flow and working capital because I knew that I wanted to start my own practice at that point in time. I just knew that I needed money saved up to do that.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Starting lean when you start a practice is really important and only purchasing things when you need it. It has to justify. If you buy a piece of equipment, how many times do you have to perform the procedure to make the money back, thinking about that, cutting back on vendor purchases or offering more of a curated product of frame line. I think these days, patients prefer that one-on-one time, that one-on-one experience to feel like they've had an amazing experience at the store. You don't have to purchase a million things that don't get bought, instead focusing on limited product lines and setting aside cash reserves to pay bills and reducing your overhead capital expenditures and working with your vendors and landlord, if it's possible, if they're willing to negotiate with you.

Jennifer’s Money Lesson:

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
I would say, little by little, a little becomes a lot. These little steps that you set in place for the long road is really important. One of the things for me is making sure that you have your financial steps in place. At least for me, that was refinancing my student loans, that was the very first step. For example, I use Laurel Road. Right now, I think federal interest rates are so low it's silly to not take advantage of that. It's great to have this digital lending platform that is built for specifically young professionals in healthcare as well to work towards their goals. There's definitely perks and rewards that they have for healthcare professionals. Refinancing definitely helps you with savings over time, and that's how you can use working capital to invest towards your future or your dream practice or something that you want to build.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, and it's also going to help your credit score to have all of your finances in order, obviously, which is going to help if you do need to get more funding, especially if you get these unexpected things like a pandemic and you need to access maybe more capital, more time to pay loans and better rates than you maybe thought before.

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Right, exactly. I agree.

Jennifer’s Money Tip:

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
Yeah, shiny object syndrome is definitely a public enemy if you go down this rabbit hole of just purchasing everything you find. They're really good at it with marketing, you're just sitting at home, scrolling through your phone on social media and there's something that you want. I remember when I first graduated out of school, with my first paycheck living in New York City, the first thing I decided to buy was a Chanel bag. That was the worst decision I ever made. I could not pay rent the next month. I learned really, really quickly to not do that. I think that was because of Sex and the City. I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is so cool living in New York."

Dr. Jennifer Tsai:
But I think learning stuff like that is really important. You don't have to have every single piece of brand new state-of-the-art technology in your office. I know you want it for your patients and for your store, but you want to start off very lean so that your savings don't get sucked dry so fast.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, and I think that makes sense. I mean, I was upset because the style that I wanted on your eyeglasses store was sold out, but you kept your inventory tight so you're living true to that. You don't want to buy so much inventory that you're holding on to inventory. You're starting out your business lean.

Bobbi’s Financial Grownup Tips:

Financial Grownup Tip #1:

Take your time. I was so frustrated that the glasses I wanted to order it were sold out on her online store, Carrot Eyewear, but Dr. Jen explained that she needed to control her risk exposure by keeping inventories lean, even if that meant losing out on some sales, like to me. Yes, it may slow the pace of the retail business growth, but when the pandemic hit, she wasn't over leveraged. Patience pays. Think about how you can buy just what you need so you don't feel stretched and stressed.

Financial Grownup Tip #2:

Paying down debt is all good, but as we have learned in the past eight or nine months, well, it shouldn't be at the expense of having enough cash on hand to manage through something totally unexpected, like a global pandemic. Don't miss any payments, be mindful, think about how you can refinance maybe at a lower rate as Jen did, especially with our still super low interest rates, but also do the other things to build your life and keep living.

Episode Links:

• Jennifer’s websites -

  • www.drjennifertsai.com

  • www.lineofsightvision.com

  • www.carroteyewear.com

Follow Jennifer!

• Instagram - @drjenandjuice

• Instagram - @lineofsightvision

• Instagram - @carroteyewear

• Facebook - Carrot Eyewear

• LinkedIn

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

YouTube superstar Sarah Wilson documented and inspired others with her journey to being debt free. But after she got to do the debt free scream with Dave Ramsey, she had a whole new set of challenges. Plus Sarah saves Bobbi from buying things she can get for free at the Fincon conference. 

Sarah's money story:

sarah wilson:
five years ago I was working in a newspaper for about $26,000 a year. I had deferred my student loans from college, and there were $33,000 of them. I lost my job. Suddenly I was extremely scared and I swore to myself that whenever I got a new job, I would figure this money thing out. Because being unemployed would've been so much less stressful had I not had $33,000 worth of student debt looming.

sarah wilson:
So, I got a new job making $26,000 a year at a newspaper, in a new state, and I started budgeting. I did everything possible to lower my expenses, increase my income, side hustling. And over the next three years, I actually documented it on YouTube. Every single week, I'd go on and tell people how much debt I had left and what I was doing that week to help fix it. It took me three years and a couple of different jobs where I raised my income a little each time, but I paid off all my debt.

bobbi rebell:
We're so proud of you for that. And also, what you're leaving out with your modesty is that while you were doing this, there was something about you. You have a relatability and an it factor that you also developed a huge following of fans and supporters while doing this. How many YouTube subscribers do you have right now?

sarah wilson:
A little over 56,000.

bobbi rebell:
Wow. And you also have monetized that. So, you actually have this side business of this YouTube channel, which is really inspiring and helping so many people. Then you hit a big milestone a year ago and that changed everything. We're going to start your story, your money story that you're going to share, with a big scream.

sarah wilson:
Yeah, I actually went on the Dave Ramsey show because I was a huge fan of his and I was following his steps to get out of debt. I was able to do my debt free scream live in studio. That was just incredible. It felt like closing and opening a chapter in my life.

bobbi rebell:
It's a big milestone and it brings us to what we want to talk about, which is what happens when you reach your money goal. Because your money goal was to be debt free. That scream was so symbolic. Then what?

sarah wilson:
The first thing I decided was to save up a giant chunk of money. Once again, ala Dave Ramsey. I saved six months worth of living expenses in case I ever lost my job again. I would be okay for a while. Or if I suddenly got into a car accident, or a medical thing, it just gives so much peace to know that I have 10 grand sitting in a interest earning bank that I can use if something terrible happens.

sarah wilson:
And then I also started investing, which is super fun and kind of intimidating for someone who was never taught about money.

bobbi rebell:
How did you start investing?

sarah wilson:
I did a lot of research, and procrastinated way too long. And then I just kind of jumped in. I bought a few index funds. I did a little robo-investing. Just kind of got my feet wet and figured out what was right for me. I'm still exploring that. I'm starting to purchase, actually, some single stocks and do some more exploratory stuff.

sarah wilson:
I funded my... I did more retirement funding for her, so I opened a couple of Roth IRAs. It's a really fun time now because I'm learning about all of that, which was not within my capacity when I was getting out of debt. I couldn't think about future dreams then.

bobbi rebell:
How specifically are you learning? What are your tools and how did you set up these things? I mean, if we get really basic, did you choose a robo-advisor? Did you just walk into a branch of a brokerage firm? I mean, what specifically did you do at that point?

sarah wilson:
Well, I tried working with a planner first and then I didn't like that. They wanted 5% of whatever I invested and I was like, "You know what? No. I can figure this out. I figured out how to get out of debt. I can figure this out on my own."

sarah wilson:
So, I've read every single thing that Bigger Pockets has ever wrote. I've watched so many YouTube channels that my friends are on. As they've learned, they've shared that information as well, which is incredible. And read a couple of books. Erin's Broke Millennial's Guide To Investing, TFD, all of it.

bobbi rebell:
The Financial Diet.

sarah wilson:
Yes.

bobbi rebell:
It's The Financial Diet.

sarah wilson:
Oh, I'm sorry, the Financial Diet. And of course, How To Be a Financial Grownup by someone you might know.

bobbi rebell:
Thank you. I think education is such an important message. As you go through the different phases of being a grownup, your phase one was paying off the debt. Your phase two is educating yourself to grow your money. So, you didn't go with a financial advisor that wanted to take 5%. What did you go with? Are you with a discount brokerage. Are you with a robo-advisor? How did you come to those decisions?

sarah wilson:
Right. I don't advise people who watch my channel to do this, because I think you should do things more simply. But I have, probably, 15 different investment accounts. I have accounts at Vanguard. I have accounts at different robo-advisors. Because I wanted to try everything, and I wanted to see the pros and cons.

bobbi rebell:
So, you're sampling?

sarah wilson:
Yeah, I'm sampling. I will continue to kind of narrow things as I figure out what is right for me. The different fee structures, pros and cons, that kind of thing.

bobbi rebell:
That's interesting. And so-

sarah wilson:
I'm not advising that. People ask me like, "Well, what do you think of Robinhood?" And I'm like, "I don't know. Let me go try it."

bobbi rebell:
Right. Well, one thing that people should... I just want to note. Very often, if you do consolidate your money and you get to a certain level, you can get benefits at these things.

sarah wilson:
Yes.

bobbi rebell:
So, I do advise you even though I don't... But I advise you to consider consolidating into fewer accounts than 15 at some point.

sarah wilson:
Yes.

bobbi rebell:
Because there are often benefits. People do want to reward their better customers. And also, from a question of just tracking your money and having those efficiencies. That might be something to consider.

sarah wilson:
I have a lot of spreadsheets right now.

bobbi rebell:
You mentioned in terms of your bigger picture life planning, what have you been able to do since paying off your debt?

sarah wilson:
The next big thing is going to be buying a multifamily property, and house hacking that into another stream of income. This is something I never dreamed of before. I never thought I'd be able to buy a house on a currently around $50,000 a year. But I have no debt. I live off of about 50 to 60% of my income, invest and save the rest.

bobbi rebell:
And explain what house hacking is. And that's a topic we're going to cover, actually, on a new Financial Grownup episode coming up.

sarah wilson:
Wonderful. House hacking is say I purchased a duplex for $200,000. Because I live in Texas and I'm very lucky. So, I move into one unit and then the other unit I rent out for say a little bit above what my mortgage payment and taxes are for the entire property. Suddenly, I've got essentially someone else, a renter, paying my mortgage for me. I've opened up another line of income and I'm also building equity in this home. In a couple of years, I can be saving the money that I'm saving on rent and do that again. Rent out both sides and maybe move into a different property, or maybe a fourplex.

“I was able to do my debt free scream live in studio. That was just incredible. It felt like closing and opening a chapter in my life.”

Sarah’s money lesson:

sarah wilson:
I think that money mastery is a muscle and that none of us are born with it. And if we had been having this conversation three years ago, it would've been like, "I can't talk about house hacking. I can't talk about investing right now. I can't. I don't have the capacity."

sarah wilson:
But by doing small things in the direction of your goals, whether it's cutting your grocery budget a little bit, or ballsing up and opening your first investing account, even though you're a little intimidated, making those steps is going to get you to the place where you are financially free. You just have to keep moving forward one step at a time. You can't just suddenly wake up and be you.

bobbi rebell:
You make a great point to not be afraid. And even though I do hope that you eventually consolidate your 15 accounts, I do think there's something to be said for just starting. If you open an account at a brokerage firm and you decide, for whatever reason, it's not the right fit, you can move that money to someplace that is a better fit. It doesn't have to be forever, but it should be starting.

“It just gives so much peace to know that I have $10,000 sitting in an interest earning bank that I can use if something terrible happens.”

Sarah's everyday money tip:

bobbi rebell:
I want to transition to talking about your money tip because this is something that I totally did not know. I am significantly older than you, but apparently other people do. My husband made fun of me now for not knowing this. However, I feel that I have to be honest that I did not know to do this all these years, and maybe there are other people out there that haven't.

bobbi rebell:
We were chatting earlier at FinCon and I mentioned that I'd forgotten toothpaste. I had a toothbrush, I forgot the toothpaste. You gave me this amazing advice because I was about to go buy one. Go for it. What's your money tip?

sarah wilson:
I told you to go down to the front desk and ask the concierge, or hospitality, or the front desk clerk, just tell them that you forgot your toothpaste and toothbrush and they will give you one.

bobbi rebell:
For free.

sarah wilson:
Yeah, completely free. Like 50 feet away from the gift shop where they sell a miniature size toothpaste for $4 and a toothbrush for 3. He'll just hand you one.

bobbi rebell:
Not only did they give me toothpaste, they gave me a toothbrush. A full size toothbrush, by the way, Sarah.

sarah wilson:
Yeah. Like an Oral B toothbrush and then like Crest mini toothpaste.

bobbi rebell:
Totally.

sarah wilson:
It's the good stuff.

bobbi rebell:
And apparently they give away other stuff. The concierge.

sarah wilson:
What else do they give away?

bobbi rebell:
My husband has informed me they give away combs. They can give you a razor. All kinds of things that you would go to the gift shop right next door and purchase.

“By doing small things in the direction of your goals, whether it’s cutting your grocery budget a little bit, or opening your first investing account, even though you’re a little intimidated, making those steps is going to get you to the place where you are financially free.”

Bobbi’s Take:

Financial Grownup tip number one:

I never thought about the fact that hotels and tons of other places that we visit, that we see throughout our everyday lives, have lost and founds. They do, guys. It's not just school.

When you're growing up, this can be very important. If you lose something, or misplace it, or maybe if you need a charger, like Sarah did. I know this is very basic, but just like I didn't know that you could just ask for things for free from a hotel front desk, that were for sale right around the corner. Make sure that if you misplace something, or you just maybe need to borrow something, again like a charger, you ask if there is a lost and found. Maybe the thing that you lost is there, or maybe something that you need to borrow is there.

I once left a pair of shoes in a hotel. Don't ask how I lost the shoes. I was wearing other shoes. Just trust me. And I called anyway. They looked in the lost and found. Sure enough, they were there and they mailed the shoes to me. All is not lost. Just ask.

Financial Grownup tip number two:

Financial Grownup tip number two. Sarah is all over the place with her investing. That's her thing right now. We're not going to judge. But I do want to caution that although I said in our interview that you don't want your resources too scattered, and that there are often perks that you get if you have larger balances and you consolidate in one place, it's also okay to have your resources in a few places. Maybe not, and I know it's an expression but, put all your eggs in one basket. Put all your eggs in just a few baskets. Not too many, but a few.

Maybe I'm a bit paranoid, but sometimes things do go wrong. There have been companies that have gone out of business, or sometimes something not so legal happens in some places that seem to be pretty above board until they're not. So, it's okay to have your wealth in a few places. Make sure that they have the appropriate protections in place. Whether it's a bank with FDIC insurance. Or SIPC, for example, for a brokerage. And understand what that protects.

For example, SIPC is not going to protect you from a stock's value going down. That's just the market. What it does protect you from is the custody function of a broker. So, if a brokerage firm fails, that's going to give you some limited protection. Take the time to understand the protections for your investments when you choose what entities to park your money in. Whether it's banks or brokerage firms, what have you, there's a lot of startups, make sure that they've been vetted, make sure you understand the protections that are in place. Made a deliberate decision about how many entities you're going to be parking in your money in. Again, 15 seems like a lot. Whatever works for you, though. I think it's your decision. Just make sure it is deliberate, as I said.

Episode Links:

• Sarah’s Website - www.gobudgetgirl.com

• Sarah’s Dave Ramsey Debt Free Scream - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ofhfT4mx7s

Follow Sarah!

• YouTube - @BudgetGirl

• Facebook - @GoBudgetGirl

• Instagram - @GoBudgetGirl

• Twitter - @GoBudgetGirl

• Pinterest - @GoBudgetGirl

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

College can be the ultimate adulting experience- including taking on some bad money habits if students aren’t taught the right way to start building a financial life.

4 Things College Students Need To Learn About Money

• Debt can be dangerous (credit cards are not free money, student loans must be repaid)

• Cash flow is king (save money, start budgeting, know needs vs. wants)

• Run your own race (know priorities and allocate dollars accordingly)

• Money is a tool that can help or hurt you in reaching your goals

Episode Links:

• Blinkist - The app I’m loving right now. Please use our link to support the show and get a free trial.

• Tara’s website - www.reisupllc.com

• Tara’s courses MONEY and WEALTH

  • Tara is offering 20% off of either course to our Financial Grownup community. Use the code GROWNUP20 at checkout

Follow Tara!

• Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/reisupllc/

• Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/reisupllc/

• Twitter - https://twitter.com/reisupllc

• YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCe5MrXlrFYJmvRzN9XDAeLA

• LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tarafalcone/

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Kara Perez of Bravely go and The Fairer Cents podcast shares how she tackled more than $25,000 in student debt making between $9 and $12 an hour. Plus her go-to home recipes for making foods you normally buy in the store including bread, pickles and tomato sauce.

“I had 5 student loans total. Four of them were public. One was private. And zero financial education.”

Kara’s money story:

Kara Perez:
Yes, so let me paint you a picture. I'm 26; I'm living in Austin, Texas. The year is 2014 and I am crying about money every day, because I don't have any and I have a lot of student loan debt and it's ruining my life.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay, just paint the numbers. What do the numbers look like?

Kara Perez:
Yeah. So, in 2014 I made $18,000. I graduated college in 2011 with $25,302, so flash forward back to 2014, I still have a little over $18,000 in debt. So, my income is equivalent to my debt. I'm making between $800 and $1,100 a month, working as a caterer for $12 an hour and as an MMA gym receptionist for $9 an hour.

So, the money is not really there.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right. And how did you feel?

Kara Perez:
Oh, I felt awful. I just was very much so treading water, if not falling backwards. I had to put one of my student loans ... I had five separate student loans ... I had to put one of them into deferment, because I couldn't make payments on it. I just didn't have enough money. And I was living in Austin, Texas with three roommates. I was trying to be frugal, but it was just ... the numbers quite literally did not add up, and I felt trapped, because I didn't know anything about money.

I didn't know how to use what I had. I didn't know how to get more of it, and I had no idea how to tackle my debt. It just felt like a weight on my shoulders everyday.

Bobbi Rebell:
And I just want to dial back a little bit. How did the debt come about in that, when you were taking it out, did you receive any financial education in the schools? Was it federal loans? Were they private loans? Were you consolidating them? What did this debt look like?

Kara Perez:
Yeah. I had five student loans total. Four of them were public; one was private, and zero financial education. I mean, god bless my mom in many ways, but growing up, we didn't talk about money, except for the fact that we didn't really have to. Single parent household. I have two siblings, and it was just very much so like, no we can't get that. We don't have the money for it. Not, hey, here's what the budget looks like and here's how much we're spending on rent, so we can't spend such and such ... you know, I just didn't have that break down. And in college, I also didn't get that break down.

And so, the narrative I heard was like, well, you'll take out loans so you can afford to go to school, you'll get a job and you'll pay them back. But of course I graduated in 2011, which was the aftermath of the recession and no one cared about my degree in English and jobs were changing and the workplace was changing. That path of take out the loans, get the job, open a 401K, pay back the loans, it wasn't really there anymore.

And so, it was just a whole lot of, "What am I doing?" in my mid-twenties.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, what was the Google search for? What did you search on Google for?

Kara Perez:
Quite literally, how to pay off student loans faster.

Bobbi Rebell:
And what did you find?

Kara Perez:
What was amazing is that a bunch of people who were blogging about personal finance popped up, and now I'm friends with many of those people. I fell into the world of personal finance blogging, where people were sharing their own stories in very casual ways of, "Hey, we're trying to pay off $100,000 in medical school debt," or "We're saving to buy our house in cash." And I thought, okay, this story features a cop and a teacher. If they can do it, I can do it.

For the first time, instead of feeling overwhelmed by money, this insight into other people's stories via their blogs made me feel like, oh, you're a normal person; I'm a normal person. If you can do it, I can do it.

So, from that, I spent two months just voraciously reading personal finance blogs, everything, anything. I was just crushing it. And then I started implementing some of the things I learned in my own life. So, even though I still had a really tiny income, I was able to pay off about $3,000 in 2014 in student loan debt. And so I was making $18,000, paid of $3,000.

Bobbi Rebell:
What specifically did you do? What were the first things that you learned?

Kara Perez:
First thing I learned was to sign up for automatic withdrawals from my checking account to pay my student loans, because I got a .25 percent interest reduction. So, even though it was a teeny amount, and even though I was scared because I didn't always have money in the account, I signed up for it anyway and just committed to always having money in the account. I was like, I'll just find a way. If that means I have to cut back on going out, that's totally fine. If that means I have to pick up an extra shift, I'll pick up an extra shift, but I want to get that reduction so I pay less in interest and I can get out of debt faster.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay, what other things did you do that you learned?

Kara Perez:
The other biggest thing I would say was just getting organized about which debt I was paying off at a time, because I used to just make an extra $20 payment on this loan and an extra $20 payment on that loan, and my extra payments were kind of just thrown all over the place, and thus they weren't really making an impact.

So, I streamlined it. I used the debt avalanche pay off method, and made all my extra payments on my highest interest debt, and that really started compounding quickly, because an extra $20 every two weeks starts to add up, and then the more money ... I started also focusing on earning more, and in 2015 I made $32,000, which felt like, whoo, so much money!

I was able to put more towards the debt and make an extra $100 payment or something every two weeks, and it really, really started to go down quickly.

“With the right information and the right application you can change your life”

Kara’s money lesson:

The biggest lesson is, with the right information and the right application, you can change your life. So, even if you are really low-income or you're working part-time jobs, or you don't have access to a lot of tools that maybe you see other people having access to, find out what works for you. So, for me, again, it was signing up to get that interest reduction. It was getting very frugal. It was making more money via picking up other side hustles, so that I could funnel all of that toward my debt.

“It often is a healthier choice to make things at home, as well as a time saving and money saving choice”

Kara’s money tip:

Kara Perez:
Yeah, so I am a big ... well, I don't want to say a big, but I am becoming a big at-home cook.

Bobbi Rebell:
We're all evolving.

Kara Perez:
We're all evolving. I'm trying, because I spent so long in the food service industry, I would always take home leftovers. I didn't have any cooking skills. So, this year, I have really focused on making more things from scratch, and I know that sounds a little like, oh, bougie, like, oh you have the time, and you have the energy to do it.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, and not only that, it's just intimidating also, because a lot of things that you think ... you look around the supermarket and things are made for you. There are things ... it's one thing to say, I'm not going to buy prepared food. I can cut up the cantaloupe myself. Okay, we know you can do that, but a lot of things that we buy, that I assume have to be made in a factory, apparently don't.

Kara Perez:
Definitely not. So, my big thing this year has been making homemade bread, which sounds, again, kind of intimidating, but it's actually so easy.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, because what if you don't have a bread maker. I don't even have room if I wanted to get one for a bread maker.

Kara Perez:
Right. I don't have a bread maker either. You just put your flour, your yeast, your salt and if you want to put something like oats or something in there, you just put it in a bowl, mix it all up with some water, and then you let it rise over night.

The mixing takes two minutes max, you let it rise, and then you pop it in the oven for about 30 minutes, and then boom, beautiful, delicious bread.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, why does everybody feel they have to buy a bread maker? What do the bread makers do?

Kara Perez:
I honestly don't even know.

Bobbi Rebell:
I don't know. I hope the bread maker people don't come after us.

Kara Perez:
The bread maker lobby.

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly, but there are appliances for every little thing that I don't think that I don't think we really necessarily need, because that's one of my hesitations is, I don't want to do that, I don't want to take out. Like I know I could make mayonnaise myself, but you have to take out the food processor or whatever.

So, there's a couple other things that you're actually going to tell us how to make by ourselves, without having to go to the store, which by the way, also, you're avoiding all the preservatives and all that yucky stuff.

Kara Perez:
Yeah, it often is a healthier choice to make things at home, as well as a time saving and money saving choice. So, I also have started making pickles at home, which is, again, just literally you cut up the cucumbers, you stick them in your jar with some vinegar, some herbs, water, garlic and then you put the top on, and put it in the fridge for 12 hours, and then you've got pickles.

Bobbi Rebell:
Great. I would never think about that. All you have to do take the cucumber and do that, and then it's pickles.

Kara Perez:
Yep.

Bobbi Rebell:
But we always just ... I don't know. It never occurred to me.

Kara Perez:
Yeah, it does work.

Bobbi Rebell:
You got one more.

Kara Perez:
And I make tomato sauce, which we eat a lot of pasta in my house, and so, that, again, it's just kind of stewing the tomatoes, the onions, the garlic, for about 30 minutes and then, boom, tomato sauce.

Bobbi Rebell:
And by the way, I know making pasta is actually not that complicated either. It's basically just making the dough, and you don't need the fancy pasta-maker. You could just cut it into spaghetti or fettuccine or whatever shape you want. There's even just, little rollers that can make different shapes. So, you don't need the fancy pasta machine, that you therefore don't have to buy, and in my case, also, you don't have to have counter space for, because I'm in an apartment. So, I think that's a big thing to remember, that these don't require special equipment.

Kara Perez:
That's such a good ... I didn't even know that. I've been intimidated to make pasta, but now maybe that will be my goal for the next month, make some homemade pasta.

Financial grown-up tip number one:

Be proactive and take ownership of your financial challenges, and don't over-complicate them. For Kara, just having the information by Googling it, and looking up the most simple stuff and then figuring out the tools to create debt re-payment strategies was enough to get her on the path to success.

Financial grown-up tip number two:

Think about the things that we buy from the store that we don't have to buy. We already kind of have them right there, just in a different form. Maybe the labeling is different, but we basically already have them. We don't have to pay up for the fancy brand name.

For example, a lot of cleaning solutions are made up combining products you already have. Sometimes, just adding water. So, for example, and I got this from the Good Housekeeping Institute, which I'll leave a link to in the show notes. You could mix four tablespoons of baking soda with a quarter of warm water and you have a cleaning solution that works on kitchen counters, appliances and the inside of your refrigerator, so you don't need to buy separately another cleaning item, which may even have more chemicals added, who knows what, and you're keeping it simple.

And if you aren't impressed with the money that you are saving doing that, which you should be in general, okay, think of it as keeping your home less cluttered, and your to-do list shorter because you have one less product in your life, and that is, as I said, much less clutter. Just think how proud Marie Condo would be.

Episode Links:

• Blinkist - The app I’m loving right now. Please use our link to support the show and get a free trial.

• Kara’s website - www.BravelyGo.co

• Kara’s course - Talk Money To Me

• The Fairer Cents podcast

• Good housekeeping article - https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/home/cleaning/tips/a24885/make-at-home-cleaners/

• The Four-Hour Week by Timothy Ferriss
  

Follow Kara!

• Instagram - @webravelygo

• Facebook - @webravelygo

• LinkedIn - @BravelyGoLLC

Quilt co-founder Ashley Sumner faced a totally unexpected and massive tuition bill mid-way through college after her dad’s business took a hit in the recession. The skills she learned in rising to the challenge led her first to a matchmaking business, and later to create  Quilt- a tech platform that connects female entrepreneurs online and in person.  

In Ashley's money story you will learn:

It's definitely not the lesson I thought I was going to be learning during those formative years. I can say that I'm very grateful for my upbringing, my family worked very hard, were entrepreneurs and we had a very financially stable life. My father, who had financially supported me my entire life, while I was the middle way going through school at NYU, which is arguably one of the most expensive private schools in the country, went from being a multimillionaire and extremely wealthy man to basically losing everything.

Bobbi Rebell:
What, just quickly, what had happened? Was he in an industry that changed?

Ashley Sumner:
Yeah, he's a land developer. He's an interest, he has a fascinating story, he kind of grew up with nothing, ran away from home, built up his entire career, learned this real estate trade and land development, moved west, one of the kind of first guys to go out and build land and I think during the financial crash while I was at school in 2008 everything changed and it really wasn't kind of prepared for it. He's actually since rebuilt himself up so his story is a fascinating one financially as well. But it was definitely-

Bobbi Rebell:
So you went to college with basically the understanding that you were not focused on financing your own college, it was going to be paid for, but I take it there wasn't actual money in an account that was separated?

Ashley Sumner:
Yeah, exactly. He was going to pay for the entirety of it, that was a huge part of my decision actually to go and be a musical theater major, because everybody knows you don't really graduate diving into a six figure salary and yeah that was a huge shift that took place a couple of years in, right while I was gearing up to start auditioning.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what was the talk like? What happened, did you just get a phone call one day that, "Honey, the money that was set aside for your college I need to use to rebuild my business." Or was it a gradual process, what was it like?

Ashley Sumner:
It was kind of an ongoing conversation, I mean I saw him struggle quite a bit and I've always been grateful for his capacity to show up and financially support me, throughout all of my dreams and very precocious childhood, lots of very big dreams to move to New York City from this small town. It was something that had been happening year over year and he really did try to continue to show up and support me and it was really more towards the end when I was graduating and trying to finalize my final year and where I was going to live and what I was going to start doing that we kind of came to an understanding that it was time. And I had this weird kind of desire to also ... I knew that it was time to learn, learn how to take care of myself, it was terrifying.

Ashley Sumner:
But I also knew that it was one of those things that I just trusted was going to really teach me some of the foundational things that I needed to know that I honestly beleive are the reason why I'm here today as a founder and I've been able to raise money and do some of the things that I'm so grateful to be able to do.

Bobbi Rebell:
One of the things I love is the next part of the story which is rather than just getting a job, you started a business.

Ashley Sumner:
I did. Yeah, I am definitely scrappy and the daughter of entrepreneurs, I can say that. I figured out that I had a knack in sales but not just any sales, in the space of matchmaking, so I had started, I had a start up in the matchmaking space and ultimately went on to have my own with some partners. And yeah it was just a skill that I had, you needed very little to get started outside of an ability to meet with and connect with people and listen to their needs and provide that value and that's very much the beginning of my community development career which has led me to my passion and purpose in helping others connect.

Bobbi Rebell:
Because like, and we're going to go back and talk more about Quilt, but it does make sense because you're matchmaking. Instead of romantic matchmaking you're actually matchmaking for different kinds of relationships. I do want to just touch on the fact that while you were doing this, first working for somebody but then very much an entrepreneurial venture, you still kept auditioning and I think that's really inspiring because it shows people that you don't have to give up one dream to fund the other dream.

Ashley Sumner:
Absolutely.

Bobbi Rebell:
You were able to do both.

Ashley Sumner:
Yeah, you know we're in the hyphen-hyphen-hyphen and I've been very proud of the multitude, I think, of starting off as soft skills and now hard skills that I've always had, an ability, I think, to architect. We can architect the way we want our lives to be and we don't need to kind of follow any traditional step by step or climbing a ladder and I'm grateful that my parents taught me that.

“We can architect the way we want our lives to be, and we don’t need to follow any traditional step by step or climbing the ladder”

In Ashley’s money lesson you will learn:

I think so much of having debt which I was under the weight of until six months ago is the head trash that comes along with it. I think there's a lot of shame and judgment and guilt around having that and seeing that there and there really are a lot of, I don't need to bore you with all of the ways that are out there, the practical ways that you can kind of chip off and get above water and start to breathe again. But I think kind of the mental game that it can play on you if you don't learn how to let go and understand that it's just a day by day, month by month, year by year planning, that's kind of my tip which is don't make it worse by also being so hard on yourself.

Bobbi Rebell:
I think a lot of us, not only judge other people, but judge ourselves too harshly.

Ashley Sumner:
Yeah, absolutely, I am my harshest critic. I was very ashamed to even share it with anyone, I kind of felt a little bit like an imposter or a fraud in having it. But every time I looked at it my refrain was like, "Those choices helped me get to where I am today and I'm so happy where I am today." So otherwise, who knows if I hadn't take that risk if it wouldn’t have led to now?

“It was empowering to understand how resourceful I am and how I could come up with non-traditional ways of making money”

In Ashley's everyday money tip you will learn:

Yeah, you know I have to give our head of product kudos for this, who teaches me all of those like tech savvy things. But I recently moved and I've recently learned about the abandoned cart method, when you're buying certain things online, just like leave it in the cart, walk away, go have a bit, go for a workout and then you come back and there's a miraculous little discount code hanging out in your inbox. So I think I've saved about $500 in the past few days on all of the new items that are on it's way to my home.

Financial Grown Up tip number one:

Ashley talked about the shame of debt. The reality is that debt can be a way to accomplish goals, so if you have debt for a good reason, and I'm not talking about excessive shopping sprees and all that stereotypical stuff, but I'm talking about good stuff. In her case paying for a great college education, as Ashley says, get rid of the mental trash, do not be ashamed, if it's your thing to talk about it externally, to socialize it, to talk to people about it because for some people accountability can really motivate you to pay it off faster or to figure out the right plan for you. But it's also okay to be something that you don't talk about, it doesn't have to be everyone's business, not everything about your finances for sure needs to be public, it's okay to keep it private.

Financial Grown Up tip number two:

Be sensitive and aware of what is happening financially to your parents, as is appropriate, at the appropriate age, however you define it and also of course to other members of your family, your generation and other generations. Ashley was so gracious in speaking about her fathers experiences, wealth is not always consistent, we'd like it to be, we can do things in our control to create financial stability but sometimes well a recession hits, as happened. Or an investment just doesn't perform as you had hoped and has all the research and how all the research had implied it would work. Or a business is simply struggling, things go through cycles, life is messy as they say. If your parents or members of your family can help you, maybe it's grandparents, maybe it's aunts, uncles, siblings, whatever, say thank you. But for the times that they can't, be there for them in the way that makes sense for your family.

Episode Links:

Melanie Lockhart's Financial Grownup episode

Lola conference

Check out Ashley's website -

www.WeAreQuilt.com

Follow Ashley!

• Instagram - @WeAreQuilt

• Twitter - @WeAreQuilt

• Facebook - @WeAreQuilt

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Bobbi reveals her favorite new money related books, and how to decide if they are right for you. This month’s picks include Melissa Leong's Happy Go Money, Student Loan Solution by David Carlson, Nathan Latka’s How to be a Capitalist without any Capital, Women with Money by Jean Chatzky and Work Wife by Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur.

Here are 5 money books that I truly enjoyed

• Happy Go Money by Melissa Leong

  • Melissa's Financial Grownup episode

• Student Loan Solution by David Carlson

  • David's Financial Grownup episode

• How to be a Capitalist without any Capital by Nathan Latka

  • Nathan's Financial Grownup episode

• Women with Money by Jean Chatzky

  • Jean's Classic Financial Grownup episode

  • Jean's Financial Grownup Guide episode

• Work Wife by Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur

  • Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur's Financial Grownup episode

Be sure to listen to the episode to learn if the book is for you or not

Episode Links:

• Melissa's website - www.MelissaLeong.com

• David's website - www.YoungAdultMoney.com

• Nathan's website - www.NathanLatka.com

• Jean's website - www.JeanChatzky.com

• Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur's website - www.OfAKinda.com

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

A side hustle can be a great source of extra income for things like paying down debt. But sometimes that whole paying taxes thing can slip through the cracks when the income isn’t coming from a big company with automatic withholding. Before he was the money savvy personal finance expert of today Student Loan Solution author David Carlson learned an expensive lesson about financial planning.

In David's money story you will learn:

• Why it's important to pay attention to the taxes taken out of each paycheck

• How overlooking the taxes being withdrawn from his wife's paychecks ended up costing them $8,000 in taxes

• Why it's important to put money aside for taxes from your side hustle's

In David’s money lesson you will learn:

• Why it's important to set aside some time for your finances and taxes

• Why people in their 20's generally do better to take more taxes with each paycheck

In David's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Why you should consider refinancing your student loans more than just once

• When refinancing, having a good credit score is so important so try to keep improving your credit score

In My Take you will learn:

• If you find yourself, like David and his wife, owing money on taxes, there are solutions! The most important thing is to still file your tax return

• Why it's so important to stay on top of the news when it comes to student loans

Episode Links:

David's website for his new book - www.StudentLoanSolutionBook.com

David's new book Student Loan Solution

David's other book Hustle Away Debt

Kristin Wong's episode

Check out David's website -

www.YoungAdultMoney.com

Follow David!

• Instagram - @David_Carlson

• Facebook - @YoungAdultMoney

• Twitter - @YoungAdultMoney

• Pinterest - @YoungAdultMoney

• LinkedIn - @DavidCarlson1

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

David Carlson:
And really was the perfect storm where no quarterly estimated tax on the side hustle income, not taken enough out of our regular paychecks and we owed $8,000.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. And you know what? Being a grown-up is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello financial grownups. That was the voice of David Carlson personal finance expert and now two time author. His first book was Hustle Away Debt. He now has come out with Student Loan Solution. The story he shares with us today though was about a very amateur move that he and his wife made in their younger days, but if we're being honest guys, it's the kind of mistake a lot of us have made, Just saying.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone, including our newest listeners. Thank you for checking out the show. I want to know how you heard about us. Please DM me on the socials and say hello on Instagram @BobbiRebell1 and Twitter @BobbiRebell or you can email us at hello@financialgrownup.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
Back to our friend David Carlson. His new book, as I mentioned is called Student Loan Solution: 5 Steps to Take Control of your Student Loans and Financial Life. And he knows a lot about student debt because his efforts to pay that down led to not paying something else. Here is David Carlson.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey David Carlson, you're at Financial Grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

David Carlson:
Hey Bobbi, thanks for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Congratulations on your new book Student Loan Solution. You're a familiar name to many people who follow the personal finance space, who want to learn more about managing their own money and having more money, which is always a good thing because you're a well-known author and speaker. This is not your first book. You also wrote Hustle Away Debt and you were also the founder of Young Adult Money. So it's tax season. We talk a lot about multiple income streams and side hustles. You and your wife are so good at this. Lots of income streams, lots of side hustles. But there is one big caveat when it comes to taxes that you guys discovered, not in the best situation. Tell us your money story, David.

David Carlson:
Yeah, so this kind of dates back a few years ago, my wife and I, our first full year of marriage we were both pretty recent college graduates the past year or two. Just to kind of give some context, my wife was studying for the GRE and working a few part time jobs, so she nannied. She worked a couple of other places as well, so she was working a lot. But the thing that we didn't do was look at how much was being taken out of her paycheck for taxes.

Bobbi Rebell:
How much was being taken out, anything?

David Carlson:
Well with her nannying job, which was the primary income. Yeah, nothing. Which honestly, if you would've just asked, we would've kind of been on top of things, we would have known that and been able to plan around that, but we didn't. So we kind of assumed, oh, maybe they're taking a little bit out of your paycheck to account for that.

David Carlson:
And honestly, like I said, this was first year of marriage, newer college grads, this excuse that everybody uses. But I would say that we were super busy with a lot going on in our lives and we kind of dropped the ball on checking the pay stubs, checking what was being taken out.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you also had side hustles yourself.

David Carlson:
Yeah, that's kind of what made this even worse was that was my first year that I had made significant side hustle. And by significant, I mean more than $100, $200. So a few thousand inside hustle income. Back then it was primarily freelance writing, but also I was working on spreadsheets for some small businesses, which people always kind of find unique. But in my full-time job as an accountant at the time I was working spreadsheets all day. So it was kind of a natural fit.

Bobbi Rebell:
So Ironic, you're working as an accountant, but you're not paying taxes on the side hustle income. So what happened? How did this get discovered and tell me about that conversation and what was the damage?

David Carlson:
Yeah, so we at the end of the year, got everything together, put everything in the TurboTax and saw, hey you owe $8,000 in taxes. And we were like, ah, that can't be right because we were used to throughout college and whatnot, getting some sort of refund and really kind of banking on that. For sure not expecting to pay anything in. So $8,000 and I mean really when you look back at all makes sense. I was claiming one on my W4 for allowances. Really if I would have claimed zero it could have helped cover off on some of the taxes that weren't being withheld from my wife's paychecks. And really it was kind of the perfect storm where no quarterly estimated tax on the side hustle income, not taken enough out of our regular paychecks. And Yeah, we owed $8,000.

Bobbi Rebell:
How did you feel? What was the conversation like?

David Carlson:
There may have been tear shed, but thankfully we had set aside some money to purchase a new vehicle. But again that money was for the vehicle purchase so that got wiped out and cover the taxes, which was unfortunate because you kind of feel like you made all this progress on saving. Again fresh out of college. So finally making some decent income but got wiped out.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is the lesson from that story for our listeners?

David Carlson:
The biggest lesson, just kind of broader terms was even if you're busy, set aside 30 minutes, an hour, really anytime you can put towards your finances and taxes. Something that people, I think intentionally and that that time myself don't think about until it comes tax time. But if you do a little bit of planning halfway through the year, look at your pay stubs, how much has been taken out, you need to have more withheld, what adjustments you need to make. For me personally, now I have not only zero allowances claim, but I also have additional money withheld each paycheck just to count for side hustle income. My wife does the same thing, so you can set yourself up to not owe anything if you don't want to and you just have to know your personality. Are you somebody who kind of banks on that refund and looks forward to it and it's really part of your financial plan or are you somebody who wants to pay as little as possible, than maybe ongoing $1,000 isn't a big deal.

Bobbi Rebell:
I think that's a really interesting point because people approached taxes and the concept of refunds very differently this year in 2019. We're grappling with a new tax system for the 2018 tax law change and a lot of people are not getting refunds, but in some cases it's not that they're paying more taxes. Some people are of course, but some people, it's just that their withholding was not adjusted properly, was over adjusted, let's say, and they were being given too much money in their paycheck for take home pay, not withholding enough. So it appears and feels like they're paying more in taxes. So a lot of this is psychological, right?

David Carlson:
Yeah. what I've seen is people in their 20s for the most part, they tend to do better if they do get that refund versus having to pay in just because finances are so tight and there's always something else that money can go towards. So even though you're giving the government kind of a interest free loan you could say, especially when you're starting out, it might make sense to kind of overshoot it and get that refund versus trying to get nothing back.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's move on to your money tip because this is really in your area of specialty having to do with student loans and the whole idea of how to manage them after you graduate. How is the best way not only to be paying them off but to finance the loan that you do have because people talk a lot about refinancing. It's not a one shot deal necessarily, right?

David Carlson:
Yeah, and I think a lot of people when they do refinance student loans in particular, you go through the process, you find the company that are going to refinance with. You find a rate that looks good to you, so you refinance once and you kind of set it and forget it. But one opportunity that people have, and I think this is important because private student loans, which you either have or you got through refinancing, don't have as many advantages as federal student loans. So I think this is a great thing for people who do have those private loans to think about. You don't have to just refinance once. You can look six, 12 months down the road after refinancing and see is there any other company out there that's going to offer me a better rate? And as long as there is no origination fees with that new loan, there's no reason not to take advantage of it. And right now there's so many companies that are looking to refinance student loans and build up their balance sheet of student loans. If you look enough, you most likely will find a better rate, especially if your credit score has improved over time, your credit history is solid, that's how you're going to be able to unlock some of those better opportunities.

Bobbi Rebell:
You mentioned the origination fee. Can you explain what that is and is that something that you can negotiate if there is one, can you say to them, well, I'm only going to switch to you if you can give me some help with that.

David Carlson:
Yeah, that's not common with the student loan refinancing because again, I think a lot of banks are not desperate, but they really want to get into the student loan refinance game.

Bobbi Rebell:
What's not common is it's not common to have origination fees.

David Carlson:
Yeah. It's not common to have one because it's just a disincentive for them to go with you. And again, like if you search on Google student loan refinance, the first five or six results are all going to be ads because there's so many companies trying to get in front of you so that you'll refinance with them. So it's not common. But I did want to point out if there are fees that come with setting up a new way.

Bobbi Rebell:
Avoid them.

David Carlson:
Yeah. Yup.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right. And is there any other strategy that you could use to make yourself more desirable? Obviously your credit score could get better as you move away from school and into your career. Other things that can make you a better candidate for the best refinancing.

David Carlson:
Yeah, it's they'll take a look at your income. So income and credit score are the most important. And credit score really being the most important because if you have a high credit score, it means that you are a reliable person. More likely than not, you're going to continue to make your payments on time. So I'd say I'd really stress the credit score aspect of that. Make sure that you're doing what you can to improve that score, making your payments on time. Yeah, and I guess one way to get even a lower rate is to have a cosigner, but typically I think it's best to kind of keep your student loans separate when possible. And obviously this isn't just a tip for student loans. You can also use personal loans as an example where if you have one that's going to take you five to 10 years to pay off for whatever reason, it might make sense to keep looking for that better rate every six to 12 months.

Bobbi Rebell:
Just some of the great advice in your new book, Student Loan Solution: 5 Steps to Take Control of your Student Loans. By the way, there's a forward in there, everyone from Financial Grownup guest Kristin Wong, she's also the author of Get Money. We will link to her episode and you also have endorsements from some notable people including our friend Shannah Compton Game from Millennial Money Podcast. You also have Jason Vitek who wrote You Only Live Once and [inaudible 00:12:09] who is the founder of [inaudible 00:12:10]. And you know what? Yours truly, I also endorsed the book. I think it's a really wonderful tool for everybody. Tell us more about where people can find more about you and the book.

David Carlson:
Yeah, so you can go on Amazon to check out the books. So just search student loan solution. We also have a book website but the URLs is little bit long studentloansolutionbook.com because I was too cheap to buy StudentLoanSolution.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
We can remember that David. We'll find you. We'll link to it in our show notes don't worry.

David Carlson:
And then my website as Bobbi mentioned earlier, youngadultmoney.com personal finance blog for those in their 20s and 30s. And then I'm on Twitter @DavidCarlson1 and then Instagram David_Carlson.

Bobbi Rebell:
Congratulations again David. Thank you so much.

David Carlson:
Thank you for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's get to it my friends, Financial Grownup tip number one. If you find yourself like David and his wife owing money on taxes and that's happening to a lot of us, if alike them, you do not have money set aside. There are solutions. The most important thing is to still file your tax return. If you ignore this problem, trust me it is not going away. But what you need to remember is believe it or not, the IRS, the government, as with any lender, anyone you owe money to is to some degree your partner, they want you to pay. And they will work with you depending on the solution that you work out with them you may owe penalties and you may owe interest but you're not going to go to jail if you're cooperating with them and working out a solution, it's going to be okay.

Bobbi Rebell:
You can contact the IRS to work things out. The phone number is 1-800-829-1040. We will also leave a link in the show notes to the irs.gov website and to the pages that you need to get to in order to figure out what kind of payment plan or other solution you can work out with the IRS if you owe money. It's all explained there. It's very well laid out. Don't forget to adjust your withholding for this year, 2019 so you don't face a similar situation next year.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two, stay on top of the news when it comes to student loans. Unfortunately this has become a political issue and some programs that were put into effect by previous administrations could be changed under the Trump presidency, so stay informed. I will leave some links to recent articles about proposed changes already in motion in some cases in the show notes and you can find the show notes always at bobbyrebell.com/financialgrownuppodcast.

Bobbi Rebell:
If you don't see the episode that you were looking for just by scrolling down, use the search bar on the upper right corner to search by the guest's name or any other keyword. For example, you could search in this case for student loan or taxes. I also want to mention that David has a number of companion materials to his book that you can access on his website at studentloansolutionbook.com and he also has some very cool freebies. And speaking of freebies, this podcast is free. The only payment that I ask of you guys is that you help us grow the show and that means first of all just making sure that you're subscribed so that the show auto downloads in your feed and you don't miss any episodes.

Bobbi Rebell:
If you have a free moment, reviews are so appreciated. They really mean a lot. And when people go to decide whether they want to subscribe to the show, they see good reviews and hopefully it motivates them to subscribe. And of course, the most powerful thing and the most appreciated thing is when you share it with friends who you think would also enjoy the podcast and maybe in some cases even show them what a podcast is, what the app is on their phone, and how to subscribe and download the episodes.

Bobbi Rebell:
Big thanks to David Carlson, author of the new book Student Loan Solution for helping us all get one step closer to being Financial Grownups. Financial Grownup with Bobby rebel is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Reality TV can be a job- but it often doesn’t pay like one. To film The Bachelorette and later Bachelor in Paradise Derek Peth had to take a break from his paying job in commercial banking. That’s where his emergency fund savings became the star of the show. 

Derek's money story:

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm so glad that you're here and so many of your fans are going to be tuning are going to be blown away by what they learn about you, because you're so well known as one of the ... first of all you were on The Bachelor on the JoJo season.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You did not apparently live happily ever after with her. But you went on to more success on Bachelor in Paradise season four. And you even now continue a side hustle, which we'll talk about, host a podcast about Bachelor in Paradise and The Bachelor. But we're here because, and this got by the way this announcement of what you're doing now got over 16 thousand likes on Instagram. We're here to talk about what you do for a living right now, which is you are in the financial services sector. You are a Senior Vice President at Laurel Road. So congratulations on this career path as well.

Derek Peth:
Thank you. This is the original career path. Speaking of side hustle, I think that's kind of what The Bachelor became for me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly.

Derek Peth:
Hey, more opportunities.

Bobbi Rebell:
Absolutely. And you're stilling doing that. We're going to circle back to that, but I want to talk about your money story because what you're going to share with us is something that is, on the one hand unique to you and the people that are on reality TV shows, but also very relatable to almost anyone that has ever dreamed of taking a break from their quote, real career, their everyday job. And asking our boss for a sabbatical so that they can do something, maybe a dream, maybe an opportunity for an interesting experience. Maybe financial opportunity down the road. But that's what happened to you. You were working, all of how many years ago? Four years ago maybe?

Derek Peth:
Yeah I think it was about four-ish years ago. I was working in commercial banking as a sales role down in Florida at the time. And actually it's a funny story how it all originally happened because I wasn't ready for it. I didn't signup or anything, I was very focused on my career, and I thought it was a prank call from a radio station at first. I made them email me, and I researched them.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait. How did they find you? I just assumed people apply to be on these shows. You just get this call.

Derek Peth:
I know. My sister signed me up.

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
I didn't figure it out until three weeks later when finally I ... because I had been kind of quiet about it and then finally I was like, "Hey did you happen to sign me up for The Bachelor ever?" And boom. There we go.

Bobbi Rebell:
She didn't tell you? Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
No. Her friends watch the show and it was like they all got around the computer and sent my photos and information in. But when I started thinking about this, it was like this is one of those opportunities that are once in a lifetime that can change the course of your life completely. And luckily, my mom has put self-help books in front of me my whole life, and I've been very, always interested in making sure that things were setup so that ... I ran some marketing businesses on the side when I was younger. I had a nice foundation of rental income incoming constantly that put me in a situation where I was like, "You know what? I don't necessarily need to have this job." While I enjoy what I'm doing, and I have a great relationship with my boss at the time. He really tried and he was like, "Listen, you're a sales role."

Bobbi Rebell:
Well what happened? Can you go in and say, "Hey I'm going to be on a reality TV show can I have a sabbatical of I don't know how long?" How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Exactly. I called him up. I said, "Hey I really need to have a side conversation that needs to be pretty quiet because there's some legal matters." And he was freaked out so he called me right away. But the legal matter was that I couldn't really discuss what the situation was with a bunch of people. And I just said, "I don't know. It could be one week that I'm gone, it could be eight weeks, 10 weeks." That's how long they tape for, and you have no idea going in. He went back and he reached out to HR and they tried to figure something out, but in the end, the response was basically, "This is a little too much of an ask right now, Derek. The only option is, if you want to do this you have to leave and quit, or you can keep working here. And call us back afterwards." The truth is, there's no chance on us just putting and eight week paused on your role.

Derek Peth:
Like you said, I saw it as a sabbatical of sorts, because there was that open end coming back, which I built from working by butt off in my job. And I built that foundation that I could really use to support my living without a normal income by working my butt off on the side. And again, I think there's a lesson there that really gives you the opportunity to do some unique and different things sometimes in life that we all dream and talk about, but when you're forcing yourself into the bare minimums, that's where I think, like I said, luckily I've had some of that literature in front of me my whole life and it was just pounded in my head, "Make sure you have enough income to live for a full year with what you're doing."

Bobbi Rebell:
You had a full year of income saved?

Derek Peth:
I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
How do people support themselves on these shows? Do you get paid to be on, do you get paid more if you last longer on the show? How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Some of those work that way. The actual Bachelor, Bachelorette, the first one there's no income from it, but the second show that I did that you talked about, it works that way where it's a per day payment situation. And so, it depends on what show you're talking about. Obviously, as we both know, the Instagram ad game has become I think the goal for a lot of people after that. And that's where the supporting themselves, and being a public figure offers some cool opportunities to do some travel where, if you're going and doing speaking somewhere or just doing an event anywhere, a lot of times there's free travel or the event itself, I should say, takes care of the travel and the accommodations. It is a unique situation. It's a little bit different than having to jump on Spirit because you're flying all over the place.

Bobbi Rebell:
But people going on these shows are not necessarily paid. There are costs involved, and you often lose your income. I don't know that people really understand that.

Derek Peth:
Yes. And that's why a lot of the people end up on the show, I think, are entrepreneurs. When you really think about it, there's business people and some small business owners a lot of the time, and it's because they have the flexibility to do that, they don't have this fear of having to jump of a cliff with their job, because it's scary thing. Not to mention just the nature of the United States these days. I don't know the exact numbers, but the cost of college has quadrupled or more in the last few years, and when you really look at that and compare that to what you come away with, and what you need, we have to have that income in order to just survive, right? Just the environment itself has made it so hard for people to jump out and do anything unique like this without cutting away, and living at home, and dodging their student loans.

Derek’s money lesson:

I think that rule is so important for people to live by. Instead of focusing on how do I get to the next paycheck, you got to focus on a rule, a separate goal. And that maybe 5% of their income for some people, 10% of their income. That's a conversation, especially if there's relationships, there's other situations that come in, but instead of maxing out what you're making, there needs to be savings goal and then a long-term goal of course. One of my favorite sayings is, how do you eat the elephant? One bite at a time. You have your big goal, but then one little step at a time, each month, each week, you're saving that money away, and that's how you, I think, create that foundation to give you the opportunity to go and do some different things.

Bobbi Rebell:
And also because as much as these kinds of ventures can create opportunity, at the end of the day, you're not an actor.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You have a normal life to some degree. It will never be quite as normal again, and you're still doing a lot of Bachelor related things, but you have an actual job.

Derek Peth:
There's a few very successful individuals. No different than professional sports. Honestly every aspect of business and any job in and of itself has high performers, and medium as well. But a lot of people in that quote, medium performance, which of course relates to how many Instagram followers you have now. But they really butt their head up against the wall and get sucked into this life with these hopes and aspirations without the understanding that it does take the work no different than your job to do some hustling, to make connections, to call people, to set things up for yourself. They do the bare minimum, and sometimes that's nice for a little while, but I mean, I think the people who have been very successful with taking this opportunity that The Bachelor presents you with and have treated it like a job. You see some of those folks who previously had jobs.

Derek Peth:
I have a great example from my season. Wells, great example. They were high performers in what they were doing already. And they pivoted everything into, all right, this is my new side gig. I can just take the same lesson I learned from working hard and taking care of business in my day-to-day life and apply it to this new opportunity.

Derek's everyday money tip:

My money tip, especially for millennials like myself is, first and foremost, within the marketplace we're in, there's an urgency to refinance your student loans. We ourselves we save over $20 thousand, on average, for people who refinance their loans, when you look at the life of their loans. I think knowing your rate in the first place is a great place to start. A lot of people, a lot of my friends even when I started working at Laurel Road they didn't even know what their rate was. And I started talking to them about the opportunities and they were just mind-blown at how much they could save each year.

I don't mean that facetiously. They were shooting, kicking themselves saying, "Hey, I'm an idiot. I haven't been looking at this. I didn't even know that. Here I am complaining about my income, and I could have saved it just by going online, doing a little bit of research." And to all those millennials out there, or anyone else who's recently gone through school and still has those student loans, go refinance them. There's no cost. It's very quick. I'm going to say, go check out Laurel Road's website because we are, I think, the best at this, but across the board, that's the number one thing we need to be doing.

Financial grownup tip number one:

Emergency funds aren't just for when bad things happen. In this case, a really amazing thing happened, a once in a lifetime opportunity. Literally life-changing experiences, and Derek had the financial resources available to cover up to a year. So when he was on The Bachelorette, not a lot of financial stress. And then even more fun on Bachelor in Paradise. And by the way, did I mention he hosts The Bachelor podcast, which is strangely addicting, even though I don't even know all the people that Derek, and Kay his co-host, are talking about. Don't be judgey. Derek has had a great ride. And I'm not saying that I know anything, or that Derek told me any upcoming projects, maybe when we kept talking after we stopped taping. But you want to stay tuned to what Derek is up to. Follow him on all the socials, and keep tabs on him at Laurel Road.

Financial grownup tip number two:

I joked with Derek about being judgey. We can all get judgey, myself included, about productivity, and joke that if we spend all day watching Netflix, or whatever, on Instagram, on our social media channels, we're not going to be building our businesses, our personal brand empires or whatever our goals are. So yes, we have to be mindful of our time. Go listen to the Laura Vanderkam episode for tips on that, by the way. But you know what, I really enjoyed Derek and his cohost on The Bachelor podcast. And the Bachelor shows are really fund. If that's your thing, enjoy it. Like all indulgences, chocolate, try to keep it under control. Maybe do a Bachelor in Paradise marathon over the holidays with your friends, get it out of your system for a little bit, then be more productive in the new year. Enjoy it. Don't feel bad. It's all good. And then of course, come back and listen to all the good advice here on Financial Grownup to get your finances in order for the new year.

Episode Links:

• Derek’s website - Laurel Road

• The Betchelor podcast

• The Bachelor

• The Bachelorette
  

Follow Derek!

• Instagram

• Linked In

• Twitter

• Facebook

Want to learn more about productivity? Click Here to listen to our episode with "Off the Clock" Author @LauraVanderkam

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

3 Student Loan Tips

• What an Income Driven Repayment plan is and why you should look into applying for this

• The benefits and drawbacks of refinancing student loans

• Taking advantage of PSLF (Public Service Loan Forgiveness)

Episode Links:

The website for David’s book - www.studentloansolutionbook.com

David's book Student Loan Solution

Davids website - www.youngadultmoney.com

Follow David!

Twitter - @DavidCarlson1

Instagram - @David_Carlson

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Reality TV can be a job- but it often doesn’t pay like one. To film The Bachelorette and later Bachelor in Paradise Derek Peth had to take a break from his paying job in commercial banking. That’s where his emergency fund savings became the star of the show. 

Derek's money story:

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm so glad that you're here and so many of your fans are going to be tuning are going to be blown away by what they learn about you, because you're so well known as one of the ... first of all you were on The Bachelor on the JoJo season.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You did not apparently live happily ever after with her. But you went on to more success on Bachelor in Paradise season four. And you even now continue a side hustle, which we'll talk about, host a podcast about Bachelor in Paradise and The Bachelor. But we're here because, and this got by the way this announcement of what you're doing now got over 16 thousand likes on Instagram. We're here to talk about what you do for a living right now, which is you are in the financial services sector. You are a Senior Vice President at Laurel Road. So congratulations on this career path as well.

Derek Peth:
Thank you. This is the original career path. Speaking of side hustle, I think that's kind of what The Bachelor became for me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly.

Derek Peth:
Hey, more opportunities.

Bobbi Rebell:
Absolutely. And you're stilling doing that. We're going to circle back to that, but I want to talk about your money story because what you're going to share with us is something that is, on the one hand unique to you and the people that are on reality TV shows, but also very relatable to almost anyone that has ever dreamed of taking a break from their quote, real career, their everyday job. And asking our boss for a sabbatical so that they can do something, maybe a dream, maybe an opportunity for an interesting experience. Maybe financial opportunity down the road. But that's what happened to you. You were working, all of how many years ago? Four years ago maybe?

Derek Peth:
Yeah I think it was about four-ish years ago. I was working in commercial banking as a sales role down in Florida at the time. And actually it's a funny story how it all originally happened because I wasn't ready for it. I didn't signup or anything, I was very focused on my career, and I thought it was a prank call from a radio station at first. I made them email me, and I researched them.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait. How did they find you? I just assumed people apply to be on these shows. You just get this call.

Derek Peth:
I know. My sister signed me up.

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
I didn't figure it out until three weeks later when finally I ... because I had been kind of quiet about it and then finally I was like, "Hey did you happen to sign me up for The Bachelor ever?" And boom. There we go.

Bobbi Rebell:
She didn't tell you? Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
No. Her friends watch the show and it was like they all got around the computer and sent my photos and information in. But when I started thinking about this, it was like this is one of those opportunities that are once in a lifetime that can change the course of your life completely. And luckily, my mom has put self-help books in front of me my whole life, and I've been very, always interested in making sure that things were setup so that ... I ran some marketing businesses on the side when I was younger. I had a nice foundation of rental income incoming constantly that put me in a situation where I was like, "You know what? I don't necessarily need to have this job." While I enjoy what I'm doing, and I have a great relationship with my boss at the time. He really tried and he was like, "Listen, you're a sales role."

Bobbi Rebell:
Well what happened? Can you go in and say, "Hey I'm going to be on a reality TV show can I have a sabbatical of I don't know how long?" How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Exactly. I called him up. I said, "Hey I really need to have a side conversation that needs to be pretty quiet because there's some legal matters." And he was freaked out so he called me right away. But the legal matter was that I couldn't really discuss what the situation was with a bunch of people. And I just said, "I don't know. It could be one week that I'm gone, it could be eight weeks, 10 weeks." That's how long they tape for, and you have no idea going in. He went back and he reached out to HR and they tried to figure something out, but in the end, the response was basically, "This is a little too much of an ask right now, Derek. The only option is, if you want to do this you have to leave and quit, or you can keep working here. And call us back afterwards." The truth is, there's no chance on us just putting and eight week paused on your role.

Derek Peth:
Like you said, I saw it as a sabbatical of sorts, because there was that open end coming back, which I built from working by butt off in my job. And I built that foundation that I could really use to support my living without a normal income by working my butt off on the side. And again, I think there's a lesson there that really gives you the opportunity to do some unique and different things sometimes in life that we all dream and talk about, but when you're forcing yourself into the bare minimums, that's where I think, like I said, luckily I've had some of that literature in front of me my whole life and it was just pounded in my head, "Make sure you have enough income to live for a full year with what you're doing."

Bobbi Rebell:
You had a full year of income saved?

Derek Peth:
I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
How do people support themselves on these shows? Do you get paid to be on, do you get paid more if you last longer on the show? How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Some of those work that way. The actual Bachelor, Bachelorette, the first one there's no income from it, but the second show that I did that you talked about, it works that way where it's a per day payment situation. And so, it depends on what show you're talking about. Obviously, as we both know, the Instagram ad game has become I think the goal for a lot of people after that. And that's where the supporting themselves, and being a public figure offers some cool opportunities to do some travel where, if you're going and doing speaking somewhere or just doing an event anywhere, a lot of times there's free travel or the event itself, I should say, takes care of the travel and the accommodations. It is a unique situation. It's a little bit different than having to jump on Spirit because you're flying all over the place.

Bobbi Rebell:
But people going on these shows are not necessarily paid. There are costs involved, and you often lose your income. I don't know that people really understand that.

Derek Peth:
Yes. And that's why a lot of the people end up on the show, I think, are entrepreneurs. When you really think about it, there's business people and some small business owners a lot of the time, and it's because they have the flexibility to do that, they don't have this fear of having to jump of a cliff with their job, because it's scary thing. Not to mention just the nature of the United States these days. I don't know the exact numbers, but the cost of college has quadrupled or more in the last few years, and when you really look at that and compare that to what you come away with, and what you need, we have to have that income in order to just survive, right? Just the environment itself has made it so hard for people to jump out and do anything unique like this without cutting away, and living at home, and dodging their student loans.

Derek’s money lesson:

I think that rule is so important for people to live by. Instead of focusing on how do I get to the next paycheck, you got to focus on a rule, a separate goal. And that maybe 5% of their income for some people, 10% of their income. That's a conversation, especially if there's relationships, there's other situations that come in, but instead of maxing out what you're making, there needs to be savings goal and then a long-term goal of course. One of my favorite sayings is, how do you eat the elephant? One bite at a time. You have your big goal, but then one little step at a time, each month, each week, you're saving that money away, and that's how you, I think, create that foundation to give you the opportunity to go and do some different things.

Bobbi Rebell:
And also because as much as these kinds of ventures can create opportunity, at the end of the day, you're not an actor.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You have a normal life to some degree. It will never be quite as normal again, and you're still doing a lot of Bachelor related things, but you have an actual job.

Derek Peth:
There's a few very successful individuals. No different than professional sports. Honestly every aspect of business and any job in and of itself has high performers, and medium as well. But a lot of people in that quote, medium performance, which of course relates to how many Instagram followers you have now. But they really butt their head up against the wall and get sucked into this life with these hopes and aspirations without the understanding that it does take the work no different than your job to do some hustling, to make connections, to call people, to set things up for yourself. They do the bare minimum, and sometimes that's nice for a little while, but I mean, I think the people who have been very successful with taking this opportunity that The Bachelor presents you with and have treated it like a job. You see some of those folks who previously had jobs.

Derek Peth:
I have a great example from my season. Wells, great example. They were high performers in what they were doing already. And they pivoted everything into, all right, this is my new side gig. I can just take the same lesson I learned from working hard and taking care of business in my day-to-day life and apply it to this new opportunity.

Derek's everyday money tip:

My money tip, especially for millennials like myself is, first and foremost, within the marketplace we're in, there's an urgency to refinance your student loans. We ourselves we save over $20 thousand, on average, for people who refinance their loans, when you look at the life of their loans. I think knowing your rate in the first place is a great place to start. A lot of people, a lot of my friends even when I started working at Laurel Road they didn't even know what their rate was. And I started talking to them about the opportunities and they were just mind-blown at how much they could save each year.

I don't mean that facetiously. They were shooting, kicking themselves saying, "Hey, I'm an idiot. I haven't been looking at this. I didn't even know that. Here I am complaining about my income, and I could have saved it just by going online, doing a little bit of research." And to all those millennials out there, or anyone else who's recently gone through school and still has those student loans, go refinance them. There's no cost. It's very quick. I'm going to say, go check out Laurel Road's website because we are, I think, the best at this, but across the board, that's the number one thing we need to be doing.

Financial grownup tip number one:

Emergency funds aren't just for when bad things happen. In this case, a really amazing thing happened, a once in a lifetime opportunity. Literally life-changing experiences, and Derek had the financial resources available to cover up to a year. So when he was on The Bachelorette, not a lot of financial stress. And then even more fun on Bachelor in Paradise. And by the way, did I mention he hosts The Bachelor podcast, which is strangely addicting, even though I don't even know all the people that Derek, and Kay his co-host, are talking about. Don't be judgey. Derek has had a great ride. And I'm not saying that I know anything, or that Derek told me any upcoming projects, maybe when we kept talking after we stopped taping. But you want to stay tuned to what Derek is up to. Follow him on all the socials, and keep tabs on him at Laurel Road.

Financial grownup tip number two:

I joked with Derek about being judgey. We can all get judgey, myself included, about productivity, and joke that if we spend all day watching Netflix, or whatever, on Instagram, on our social media channels, we're not going to be building our businesses, our personal brand empires or whatever our goals are. So yes, we have to be mindful of our time. Go listen to the Laura Vanderkam episode for tips on that, by the way. But you know what, I really enjoyed Derek and his cohost on The Bachelor podcast. And the Bachelor shows are really fund. If that's your thing, enjoy it. Like all indulgences, chocolate, try to keep it under control. Maybe do a Bachelor in Paradise marathon over the holidays with your friends, get it out of your system for a little bit, then be more productive in the new year. Enjoy it. Don't feel bad. It's all good. And then of course, come back and listen to all the good advice here on Financial Grownup to get your finances in order for the new year.

Episode Links:

• Derek’s website - Laurel Road

• The Betchelor podcast

• The Bachelor

• The Bachelorette
  

Follow Derek!

• Instagram

• Linked In

• Twitter

• Facebook

Want to learn more about productivity? Click Here to listen to our episode with "Off the Clock" Author @LauraVanderkam

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.